FireWire in unRAID How-to

[rxnelson]

Originally Posted by Tomahawk51

Check out this for #2 https://forums.sagetv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=59707

But, I'm wondering what's the benefit of doing a network encoder on a WinVM vs. just doing it all with the WinVM. Better performance or something on Docker?

Ahhh, thanks for the link.
I wonder the same thing. Hell, I already have a windows 10 machine built and running and kind of wonder if it is even worth building the VM until it dies.

It does seem to introduce another point of failure.

I just started relooking at the docker solution when they announced the EPG will be shuttered.

[BobPhoenix]

I was getting lots of failed recordings when using the HDPVRs directly from the SageTV Docker on linux. About 75% failure rate as a matter of fact. But putting the HDPVRs on a USB 3.0 card passed through to the Windows VM reduces that to about 10% maybe less. I have it setup as a network encoder and use the unRAID Docker because my main server when running on Windows would get reduced to a crawl and lots of spinning circles since I could only allocate 1GB to it. With the Docker I have 4G assigned to it so the response time is about as quick as I'm going to be able to get it. Very few spinning circles (just when it has to download a graphic for instance) and I get fewer bad recordings from my HDPVRs 10% failures rather than 75% when running the docker only.

Also I'm going to try linux only when I get the time to swap the USB 3.0 card for a USB 2.0 card. If that works then I can do away with the Windows VM completely. It definately made a difference when connected to MB USB 2.0 ports or the USB 3.0 card in the docker.

Make sense?

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by rxnelson

Thanks for that. It looks like the boxes aren't enabled. I got nothing in the log when I plugged them into firewire. I plugged in a miniDV cam I have and I saw something pop up in the log. I guess that is it for firewire unless I can sweet talk them into turning it on remotely?
So with two boxes it would appear that USB-UIRT is out for the docker. My other choices???
1. A windows 10 VM with USB-UIRT
2. The docker setup with the HDPVR as a network encoder?

To be honest I'm not really sure what the second one entails. I saw another user saying they did this because the HDPVR recordings were corrupted or something under linux.

The USB-UIRT and HDPVR (if it's the original 1212 model) will work from the Docker, it's just not a super simple setup at this point (though there are some on the forum who have it set up, and it may be as simple a copying their lirc files). The only real limitation is that the USB-UIRT can only blast a single zone on linux (driver limitation).

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by Tomahawk51

Check out this for #2 https://forums.sagetv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=59707

But, I'm wondering what's the benefit of doing a network encoder on a WinVM vs. just doing it all with the WinVM. Better performance or something on Docker?

Bigger JVM heap on Linux (essentially limitless, vs 1GB on windows).

[Tiki]

Originally Posted by BobPhoenix

I was getting lots of failed recordings when using the HDPVRs directly from the SageTV Docker on linux. About 75% failure rate as a matter of fact. But putting the HDPVRs on a USB 3.0 card passed through to the Windows VM reduces that to about 10% maybe less. I have it setup as a network encoder and use the unRAID Docker because my main server when running on Windows would get reduced to a crawl and lots of spinning circles since I could only allocate 1GB to it. With the Docker I have 4G assigned to it so the response time is about as quick as I'm going to be able to get it. Very few spinning circles (just when it has to download a graphic for instance) and I get fewer bad recordings from my HDPVRs 10% failures rather than 75% when running the docker only.

Also I'm going to try linux only when I get the time to swap the USB 3.0 card for a USB 2.0 card. If that works then I can do away with the Windows VM completely. It definately made a difference when connected to MB USB 2.0 ports or the USB 3.0 card in the docker.

Make sense?

10% failure rate sounds insanely high. What are the symptoms on those 10% failures?

I used my HD PVR for years without a bad recording. The only time I had a problem was when the ir blaster mis-tuned a channel. That is until I added a Colossus card. Once I did that, I found I had to reboot my PC at least once every 1-2 weeks or I would start getting corrupted recordings on both the Colossus and the HD PVR.

[wayner]

Originally Posted by BobPhoenix

I was getting lots of failed recordings when using the HDPVRs directly from the SageTV Docker on linux. About 75% failure rate as a matter of fact. But putting the HDPVRs on a USB 3.0 card passed through to the Windows VM reduces that to about 10% maybe less.

How did these failures show up? The typical Halt Detected in recording and an error message like this:

The device input "Hauppauge HD PVR 00A65EC9 Component+SPDIF" stopped producing data while recording "NHL Hockey" on TSN4HD on physical channel 497. SageTV will try to reset the device. This may be caused by a channel that is no longer available.

I don't have the same issue as you but I do have an issue where it will take about 90 seconds for a recording to start properly - and there are a few other folks with the same issue.

[wayner]

Originally Posted by Tiki

10% failure rate sounds insanely high. What are the symptoms on those 10% failures?

I used my HD PVR for years without a bad recording.

But what OS were you running - it wasn't unRAID Linux. Bob seems to have found some issues with USB ports.

I have been using two HD-PVRs in a Windows server for close to a decade with very few issues other than those caused by failing power supplies and I don't do regular reboots of the system. But I am having minor issues on unRAID where the first minute or so of a recordings has problems - and this seems to happen with OTA recordings as well as HD-PVR recordings.

[Tiki]

Originally Posted by wayner

But what OS were you running - it wasn't unRAID Linux. Bob seems to have found some issues with USB ports.

I have been using two HD-PVRs in a Windows server for close to a decade with very few issues other than those caused by failing power supplies and I don't do regular reboots of the system. But I am having minor issues on unRAID where the first minute or so of a recordings has problems - and this seems to happen with OTA recordings as well as HD-PVR recordings.

I was using Sage 6 with Win XP and Sage 7 with Win 7. Now on Sage 9 with Win 7. Never had a power supply problem.

[BobPhoenix]

Originally Posted by Tiki

10% failure rate sounds insanely high. What are the symptoms on those 10% failures?

I used my HD PVR for years without a bad recording. The only time I had a problem was when the ir blaster mis-tuned a channel. That is until I added a Colossus card. Once I did that, I found I had to reboot my PC at least once every 1-2 weeks or I would start getting corrupted recordings on both the Colossus and the HD PVR.

Originally Posted by wayner

How did these failures show up? The typical Halt Detected in recording and an error message like this:


I don't have the same issue as you but I do have an issue where it will take about 90 seconds for a recording to start properly - and there are a few other folks with the same issue.

I consider a recorded file that gets split into multiple files a failure since there will be a gap however small. I never considered a miss tune a failure of the HD-PVR. A failed recording but not the fault of the HDPVR or it's drivers. I got about 5% to 10% missed tunes when I was using my IR transmitters too. That stopped once I got HTTP tuning and DirecTV.

I used to get multiple files per recording with MB USB ports when I started using HDPVRs and Windows SageTV V6 (if I'm remembering the version of Sage that was out when the HDPVRs first came out). Then I switched to a NEC USB 2.0 card and they dropped to about 2% - 5% maybe less. Most of the time I would switch the power supply out and it would drop to almost zero for a while before I would start getting more.

It is possible that is the problem now and one of the reasons I bought some new HDPVR power bricks. I'm going to take the existing power bricks and wire them up directly to the PSU in the PC now that I have replacements. Didn't think my luck would let me just order the correct connector - I would get the wrong model and have to place multiple orders before I found the correct one. Now I have a backup with the new power bricks if I manage to wire the old ones up incorrectly.

When I was using the unRAID docker directly (not through the VM) I got 75% failures on the MB or USB 3.0 card. It would have problems starting the recording and the disconnects in the middle as well. I didn't want to have to setup beginning padding of an hour (yes it would sometimes take more then 90 seconds to get started correctly) to cover all cases of the starting problem. The breaks in the middle I didn't think I could fix that way.

I have several USB 3.0 cards to try (currently on NEC/Reneas model which I thought would be the best version) before I switch back to my dependable NEC 2.0 card. Hoping I can drop the Windows VM as well. Just going to take awhile to go through all of my options.


Note one of the reasons I may be getting a higher percentage of failures compared to you all is I have 2.2TB scheduled in the next 360 hours according to the Menu "Header"-(funny since it is a footer in v7). With only 800GB - 1TB of that on other non HDPVR tuners. Are either of you recording almost 3GB per hour on average on your HDPVRs?

[rxnelson]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

The USB-UIRT and HDPVR (if it's the original 1212 model) will work from the Docker, it's just not a super simple setup at this point (though there are some on the forum who have it set up, and it may be as simple a copying their lirc files). The only real limitation is that the USB-UIRT can only blast a single zone on linux (driver limitation).

Yep, thanks. I actually got the docker running and the HDPVR recognized and tuning a channel. As you stated though, I have two STBs and I'm not ready to give up that second source.

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by rxnelson

Yep, thanks. I actually got the docker running and the HDPVR recognized and tuning a channel. As you stated though, I have two STBs and I'm not ready to give up that second source.

well, you can probably use a second USB-UIRT... :-)

[rxnelson]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

well, you can probably use a second USB-UIRT... :-)

Maybe but I think the front blaster is "powerful". I may have to build a tin foil hat or something for the STBs. Like I said above, I could just leave it like it is and update to version 9. I'm not sure what a Windows VM even really gains me at this point as I have a Win10 machine that runs ok. I only really started reexploring due to the EPG announcement. Thanks for all the help and work everyone has done on this.

[Fuzzy]

You can still use the remote blasters - in single zone more, it doesn't JUST blast out the front window, both pins on the headphone plug are driven as well. So yeah, just tape the main window up, and use a remote emitter on each one.

[c5davey]

Over the weekend I played with this and only had partial success. I'm using a Motorola DCX-3200.

The channel changes successfully but then it appears that some extra codes are being sent afterwards. When the STB completes the channel change, it then brings up the guide and always shows the guide starting at channel 401 regardless of what channel I am tuning. Normally, when using the guide button on the remote, it comes up starting with the current channel.

It seems that the firewire code doesn't properly detect the STB. There doesn't seem to be a way to select the STB model like there was when using the channel.exe program in windows.

[gdippel]

I've been attempting to install SageTV as a docker and I have been running into a problem with Firewire channel tuning. I'm a long time SageTV user, currently running it on a Windows 10 platform using Firewire channel changing so I know my STBs have Firewire enabled. The STBs are SA4250 and SA42642.

I installed the DVB plugin, choose LibreELEC 6.4.1 (my current UnRaid version) and when I install the SageTV docker and configure it, it recognizes my 2 HD PVRs but when I choose Firewire channel changing, it states that there are no Firewire device IDs to tune.

My UnRaid box has a no name Firewire card with a TI chipset and I'm wondering if the card is the problem. When I run "ls /dev/fw*" in a shell it outputs "dev/fw0" so I'm wondering if the Firewire drivers are enen being installed. The two STBs are daisy chained, I even tried with just one box connected, same result.

Am I missing something or is it an incompatible card. BTW my board is not IOMMU compatible if that makes a difference.

[dstanley]

My DVB Plugin is the Digital Devices version and it works with Firewire and those SA boxes.
I have been running it so long I really don't remember having to do much of anything 'special' to make it work.
Hopefully someone can provide more help than me!

Dwight

[smdl]

Originally Posted by c5davey

Over the weekend I played with this and only had partial success. I'm using a Motorola DCX-3200.

The channel changes successfully but then it appears that some extra codes are being sent afterwards. When the STB completes the channel change, it then brings up the guide and always shows the guide starting at channel 401 regardless of what channel I am tuning. Normally, when using the guide button on the remote, it comes up starting with the current channel.

It seems that the firewire code doesn't properly detect the STB. There doesn't seem to be a way to select the STB model like there was when using the channel.exe program in windows.

This exactly describes the problem I'm having, and I have been using FireWire tuning for years without issue on my Win 7 box. Looks like the Linux drivers are configured for the SA STBs and are not quite sending the correct format for the the DCX-3200s. Had anyone made any progress in determining how we might be able to accommodate different STBs? FireWire tuning works so well, and I'd hate to lose it.

Thanks,
Shaun

[Striker:WG]

So i'm resurrecting this thread as I am in a very similar situation.

I have setup Unraid and now want to replace my main SageTV server with a Docker container. I've got my HDPVR's working thanks to the DVB plugin (running the Digital Devices variety). The main thing holding me back, is setting up Firewire channel changing.

I have not been able to find anything definitive that states which PCI Firewire controller cards are known to work. Even if I do get it sending signals over firewire, I have two (one Motorolla, one Arris) DCX3200-M cable boxes that from what i've seen in this thread, even though they work through Windows firewire channel changing, it may not work through Unraid.

Can anyone confirm if they've successfully gotten this working?

Thanks!

[gdippel]

While I'm not running Sage in a docker in unRaid, I am using firewire channel changing in a Ubuntu VM I'm running in unRaid. The card is PCIe and my system info shows it as VIA Technologies, Inc. VT6315 Series Firewire Controller (rev 01)

Since it's recognized as a device by unRaid I image it would also work in a docker.

[smdl]

Originally Posted by Striker:WG

So i'm resurrecting this thread as I am in a very similar situation.

I have setup Unraid and now want to replace my main SageTV server with a Docker container. I've got my HDPVR's working thanks to the DVB plugin (running the Digital Devices variety). The main thing holding me back, is setting up Firewire channel changing.

I have not been able to find anything definitive that states which PCI Firewire controller cards are known to work. Even if I do get it sending signals over firewire, I have two (one Motorolla, one Arris) DCX3200-M cable boxes that from what i've seen in this thread, even though they work through Windows firewire channel changing, it may not work through Unraid.

Can anyone confirm if they've successfully gotten this working?

Thanks!

Striker,

Yes, thanks to the help of others, I have FireWire tuning operational on DCX3200M boxes on an unRAID docker. You can find relevant information in the following threads:

https://forums.sagetv.com/forums/sho...138#post620138
https://forums.sagetv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66152

The only issue that remains is that I'm back to having the STBs shut off whenever my cable provider does a remote update to channel lineups, which they seem to like to do regularly. Previously, I had been using SageChanger under Windows, and that application had a feature where it would check before changing a channel to ensure that the box was powered on. If not, it would toggle power first, and then change channels. I really wish that FireWire tuning in Linux did this!

Best of luck,
Shaun