Long Clocks: Causation or just Correlation?

[PeteCress]

Coincident with installing Diamond, I have been seeing some very long clocks between screens.

There are several situations where this happens - some reproducible, some seemingly not.

One reproducible example:

• TV | Recordings | (choose a show with multiple recordings)
• Play one of the recordings
• Hit "Stop" during play
• (screen returns to list)
• Now move backwards one screen (i.e. click "Left")
• Observe the long clock

Here's a sample:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPWkvMCFMDY

Am I the only one?


FWIW, Wiz.bin is on the same physical disc and paritition that SageTV is running from - albeit not the System partition.

The drive is partitioned into C-System and D-Data. The complete SageTV install is on D-Data.

SageTV System Configuration Details
Friday, May 13, 2011

System Status
Friday, May 13, 2011 12:49 PM

Software Version: SageTV V7.1.5.252
Java Version: 1.6.0_24
Operating System: Windows XP 5.1
Global Alert Level: None
Current STV File: SageTV7.xml (Version 7.1.3.1 March 8, 2011, Name: SageTV7)
Current STV Theme: Diamond Simplified
Current STV file set version: 2011030801, MD5 prefix: cf417f
Online Videos version: 2011030401, MD5 prefix: ffb1b3
Online Videos updates are Enabled
Display: 1920x1200, Window: 1206 x 986
Hostname: giga
IP Address: xxx
Locator ID: xxx
Available Video Diskspace: 1862.54 GB
Recoverable Video Diskspace: 2744.40 GB
Used Video Diskspace: 3179.73 GB
Total Video Content: 36 days 18 hours 6 minutes
Used Library Diskspace: 1970.03 GB
Total Library Content: 2 days 3 hours 46 minutes
Last EPG Update: Thursday, May 12, 2011 6:01 PM
Next EPG Update In: 5 hours 11 minutes
Recording: Nothing on Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-0
Recording: "Ocean Paddler" at 12:30PM on 10-3 WCAUDT3 on Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-1
Recording: Nothing on Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-0
Recording: Nothing on Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-1
Watching: "Ocean Paddler" at 12:30PM on 10-3 WCAUDT3
Instance Uptime: 1 day 15 hours 49 minutes
Total Uptime: 120 days 11 hours 40 minutes
JVM Heap Size (Used/Total/Max): 246MB/389MB/389MB

System Configuration Details

Country: United States of America
Language: English
Time Zone: EDT Eastern Standard Time (America/New_York)
Video Format: NTSC
Capture Devices Available (* = Configured Device)
Capture Device 1*: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-0
Capture Device 2*: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-1
Capture Device 3*: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-0
Capture Device 4*: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-1
Configured Input Details
Input 1: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-0 Digital TV Tuner
Functioning: true; Network Encoder: false; RF Channel: N/A; Cable/Antenna: Antenna; EPG Lineup: Philadelphia - Digital Broadcast; Tuner Control: N/A; Audio Input: N/A
Input 2: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-1 Digital TV Tuner
Functioning: true; Network Encoder: false; RF Channel: N/A; Cable/Antenna: Antenna; EPG Lineup: Philadelphia - Digital Broadcast; Tuner Control: N/A; Audio Input: N/A
Input 3: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-0 Digital TV Tuner
Functioning: true; Network Encoder: false; RF Channel: N/A; Cable/Antenna: Antenna; EPG Lineup: Philadelphia - Digital Broadcast; Tuner Control: N/A; Audio Input: N/A
Input 4: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-1 Digital TV Tuner
Functioning: true; Network Encoder: false; RF Channel: N/A; Cable/Antenna: Antenna; EPG Lineup: Philadelphia - Digital Broadcast; Tuner Control: N/A; Audio Input: N/A
Video Directory 1: \\NAS\B\RecordedTV
Import Directory 1: \\NAS\A\Photos -- Media types imported: Videos Pictures
Import Directory 2: \\NAS\A\Videos -- Media types imported: Videos Pictures
Import Directory 3: \\NAS\B\DVDs_Library -- Media types imported: Videos 
Import Directory 4: \\NAS\B\DVDs_NetFlix -- Media types imported: Videos 
Import Directory 5: \\NAS\B\DVDs_NoBackup -- Media types imported: Videos 
Import Directory 6: \\NAS\B\DVDs_Owned -- Media types imported: Videos 
Intelligent Recording: Disabled
Sync System Clock with SageTV Server: Enabled
Show Mouse Icons: Enabled
Aspect Ratio Mode Fill: Horiz. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0, Vert. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0
Aspect Ratio Mode Source*: Horiz. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0, Vert. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0
Aspect Ratio Mode 4x3: Horiz. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0, Vert. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0
Aspect Ratio Mode 16x9: Horiz. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0, Vert. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0
Overscan Settings: Left edge: 0, Horiz. Scale: 100.0%, Top edge: 0, Vert. Scale: 100.0%
Default Recording Quality (overall): Great
Default Recording Quality (Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-0): Digital Tuner. Recording quality does not apply.
Default Recording Quality (Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-1): Digital Tuner. Recording quality does not apply.
Default Recording Quality (Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-0): Digital Tuner. Recording quality does not apply.
Default Recording Quality (Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-1): Digital Tuner. Recording quality does not apply.
SageTV Server: Enabled
SageTV Media Extender & Placeshifter Server: Enabled
Placeshifter router port forwarding method: Manual configuration
Placeshifter external TCP port forwarded on router: 31099
Java classes loaded at startup: None
Input plugin classes: None
Media Player plugin class: None
Media Player dvd plugin class: None
Media Player mp3 plugin class: None
Media Player mp4 plugin class: None
Media Player mpg plugin class: None
Media Player mpgbuf plugin class: None
Media Player xml plugin class: None
OSD Rendering plugin class: None

[jorton]

Video Directory 1: \\NAS\B\RecordedTV

Are you really recording TV directly to a NAS? This might be part of it, but only a guess cause I don't use one.

I haven't seen delays like that at all, and you don't even have banners turned on (no loading of fanart etc...) so not sure what it could be.

Please see if you are having the same issue with Diamond UI Mod disabled in the "installed plugins" area and the theme to set to "Standard" (Detailed Setup/Advanced) to see if we can rule out Diamond.

J

[PeteCress]

Originally Posted by jorton

Video Directory 1: \\NAS\B\RecordedTV

Are you really recording TV directly to a NAS? This might be part of it, but only a guess....

Please see if you are having the same issue with Diamond UI Mod disabled in the "installed plugins" area and the theme to set to "Standard" (Detailed Setup/Advanced) to see if we can rule out Diamond.

I disabled Diamond.

Clock persisted, but only ran about half as long - pending more exact measurements with a stop watch.

Others have commented on the NAS thing in separate threads.

I've got a couple of 2 tb spares laying around.

Just on GPs, I will move RecordedTV to local drives on the Sage box to see what happens.

Copy in progress.... looks like an ETA of about 16 hours.

Now I've got to go back and dig out the "How-To" for making SageTV automagically update it's pointers for RecordedTV. IRRC, it's just a matter of making the old "RecordedTV" directories unavailable and making the new ones available.... and making sure that Wiz.bin is backed up beforehand... -)

Stay tuned.

[PeteCress]

Originally Posted by PeteCress

Just on GPs, I will move RecordedTV to local drives on the Sage box to see what happens.

I don't think it's the NAS box.

Here's what I did:

• Copied all RecordedTV from the NAS to 2 local drives
• Shut down SageTV
• Backed up props and Wiz.bin
• Restarted SageTV
• Changed RecordedTV pointers from NAS to the two local drives
• Shut down SageTV
• Powered the NAS box off
• Restarted SageTV
• Observed that refs for recorded shows has magically changed from the NAS share to the two local drives
• Tried the problem situation (select a show, play it, end it, go back one menu)
• Observed no change in the length of the clock - still excessive

Now, I guess my money has tb on something with my PC: Not Diamond (although the clocks were a little longer than with the stock UI) and not the NAS.

[jorton]

Originally Posted by PeteCress

I don't think it's the NAS box.


Here's what I did:

• Copied all RecordedTV from the NAS to 2 local drives
• Shut down SageTV
• Backed up props and Wiz.bin
• Restarted SageTV
• Changed RecordedTV pointers from NAS to the two local drives
• Shut down SageTV
• Powered the NAS box off
• Restarted SageTV
• Observed that refs for recorded shows has magically changed from the NAS share to the two local drives
• Tried the problem situation (select a show, play it, end it, go back one menu)
• Observed no change in the length of the clock - still excessive

Now, I guess my money has tb on something with my PC: Not Diamond (although the clocks were a little longer than with the stock UI) and not the NAS.

Do you notice the slow down on Server and Client?

J

[jorton]

JVM Heap Size (Used/Total/Max): 246MB/389MB/389MB

Sorry, I missed scrolling through all of your system props the first time, your java heap needs to be 1024MB on your server. I also run 1024MB on all my Clients. All my machines have at least 4GB of physical ram.

Jeremy

[PeteCress]

Originally Posted by jorton

Do you notice the slow down on Server and Client?

• Server: No
• Client: No
• PlaceShifter: Yes. The pause is there in the form of a black screen - no clock.
  I ran 'shifter in two places: netbook, and server: same result except that one time I ran it on the server, the black screen was noticibly shorter... other times on server the pause was the same.
• HD200: Yes - and I tried it on two different HD200's with the same result.

On all of the above:

• Remote devices were connected via Ethernet
• I re-ran all tests back-to-back over a period of about fifteen minutes to try to minimize any TOD-related issues

[PeteCress]

Originally Posted by jorton

Sorry, I missed scrolling through all of your system props the first time, your java heap needs to be 1024MB on your server. I also run 1024MB on all my Clients. All my machines have at least 4GB of physical ram

I'm not seeing JVM Heap Size in props.

In Control Panel | Java Control Panel | Java | Java Runtime Envronment Settings | View | System it seems like I ought tb able to change something, but there don't seem tb any editable fields and nothing about "Heap Size".

Per http://javahowto.blogspot.com/2006/0...java-heap.html, it looks like there's a command-line interface.

http://www.ehow.com/how_6181628_chan...indows-xp.html looks like the real deal for XP - once I find the Java application icon...

?

[jusjoken]

Originally Posted by PeteCress

I'm not seeing JVM Heap Size in props.

In Control Panel | Java Control Panel | Java | Java Runtime Envronment Settings | View | System it seems like I ought tb able to change something, but there don't seem tb any editable fields and nothing about "Heap Size".

Per http://javahowto.blogspot.com/2006/0...java-heap.html, it looks like there's a command-line interface.

http://www.ehow.com/how_6181628_chan...indows-xp.html looks like the real deal for XP - once I find the Java application icon...

?

It's a registry setting. Try this post here for a description of changing it as well as a link to a utility that can change it for you.

k

[PeteCress]

Originally Posted by jusjoken

It's a registry setting. Try this post here

Got it.

Cold-started the server, yanked the plug on the HD200, but no change.

SageTV System Configuration Details
Monday, May 16, 2011

System Status
Monday, May 16, 2011 10:51 AM

Software Version: SageTV V7.1.5.252
Java Version: 1.6.0_25
Operating System: Windows XP 5.1
Global Alert Level: Error Alert
Current STV File: SageTV7.xml (Version 7.1.3.1 March 8, 2011, Name: SageTV7)
Current STV Theme: Diamond Simplified
Current STV file set version: 2011030801, MD5 prefix: cf417f
Online Videos version: 2011030401, MD5 prefix: ffb1b3
Online Videos updates are Enabled
Display: 1920x1200, Window: 1529 x 881
Hostname: giga
IP Address: xxxx
Locator ID: xxxx
Available Video Diskspace: 2355.64 GB
Recoverable Video Diskspace: 2286.43 GB
Used Video Diskspace: 2719.83 GB
Total Video Content: 31 days 19 hours 53 minutes
Used Library Diskspace: 1970.03 GB
Total Library Content: 2 days 3 hours 46 minutes
Last EPG Update: Sunday, May 15, 2011 6:11 PM
Next EPG Update In: 7 hours 19 minutes
Recording: Nothing on Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-0
Recording: Nothing on Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-1
Recording: Nothing on Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-0
Recording: Nothing on Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-1
Watching: Nothing
Instance Uptime: 4 minutes
Total Uptime: 6 hours 4 minutes
JVM Heap Size (Used/Total/Max): 176MB/188MB/1038MB

System Configuration Details

Country: United States of America
Language: English
Time Zone: EDT Eastern Standard Time (America/New_York)
Video Format: NTSC
Capture Devices Available (* = Configured Device)
Capture Device 1*: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-0
Capture Device 2*: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-1
Capture Device 3*: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-0
Capture Device 4*: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-1
Configured Input Details
Input 1: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-0 Digital TV Tuner
Functioning: true; Network Encoder: false; RF Channel: N/A; Cable/Antenna: Antenna; EPG Lineup: Philadelphia - Digital Broadcast; Tuner Control: N/A; Audio Input: N/A
Input 2: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-1 Digital TV Tuner
Functioning: true; Network Encoder: false; RF Channel: N/A; Cable/Antenna: Antenna; EPG Lineup: Philadelphia - Digital Broadcast; Tuner Control: N/A; Audio Input: N/A
Input 3: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-0 Digital TV Tuner
Functioning: true; Network Encoder: false; RF Channel: N/A; Cable/Antenna: Antenna; EPG Lineup: Philadelphia - Digital Broadcast; Tuner Control: N/A; Audio Input: N/A
Input 4: Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-1 Digital TV Tuner
Functioning: true; Network Encoder: false; RF Channel: N/A; Cable/Antenna: Antenna; EPG Lineup: Philadelphia - Digital Broadcast; Tuner Control: N/A; Audio Input: N/A
Video Directory 1: \\NAS\B\RecordedTV
Import Directory 1: \\NAS\A\Photos -- Media types imported: Videos Pictures
Import Directory 2: \\NAS\A\Videos -- Media types imported: Videos Pictures
Import Directory 3: \\NAS\B\DVDs_Library -- Media types imported: Videos 
Import Directory 4: \\NAS\B\DVDs_NetFlix -- Media types imported: Videos 
Import Directory 5: \\NAS\B\DVDs_NoBackup -- Media types imported: Videos 
Import Directory 6: \\NAS\B\DVDs_Owned -- Media types imported: Videos 
Intelligent Recording: Disabled
Sync System Clock with SageTV Server: Enabled
Show Mouse Icons: Enabled
Aspect Ratio Mode Fill: Horiz. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0, Vert. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0
Aspect Ratio Mode Source*: Horiz. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0, Vert. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0
Aspect Ratio Mode 4x3: Horiz. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0, Vert. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0
Aspect Ratio Mode 16x9: Horiz. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0, Vert. Stretch: 100%, Offset: 0
Overscan Settings: Left edge: 0, Horiz. Scale: 100.0%, Top edge: 0, Vert. Scale: 100.0%
Default Recording Quality (overall): Great
Default Recording Quality (Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-0): Digital Tuner. Recording quality does not apply.
Default Recording Quality (Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 10147F5C-1): Digital Tuner. Recording quality does not apply.
Default Recording Quality (Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-0): Digital Tuner. Recording quality does not apply.
Default Recording Quality (Silicondust HDHomeRun Tuner 1015CB25-1): Digital Tuner. Recording quality does not apply.
Video Renderer: Default
MPEG2 Video Decoder Filter: Default
Audio Renderer: Default
MPEG2 Audio Decoder Filter: SageTV MPEG Audio Decoder
Audio Playback Delay: 0 milliseconds
DVD drive enabled: Yes
DVD Video Renderer: VMR9
DVD Video Decoder Filter: Default
DVD Audio Renderer: Default
DVD Audio Decoder Filter: Default
Remote Control Configuration: None Selected or External Setup
SageTV Server: Enabled
SageTV Media Extender & Placeshifter Server: Enabled
Placeshifter router port forwarding method: Manual configuration
Placeshifter external TCP port forwarded on router: 31099
Load at Windows Startup: No
3D Acceleration: Enabled
Overlay Color Keying: Enabled
Service Mode: Enabled
Java classes loaded at startup: None
Java classes loaded at startup for the SageTV service: None
Input plugin classes: None
Media Player plugin class: None
Media Player dvd plugin class: None
Media Player flv plugin class: None
Media Player mp4 plugin class: None
Media Player mpg plugin class: None
OSD Rendering plugin class: None

[gplasky]

Originally Posted by PeteCress

Got it.

Cold-started the server, yanked the plug on the HD200, but no change.

No change in what? The symptoms? Because according to the log file you now have a maximum jvm of 1038MB and you're only using 176MB

JVM Heap Size (Used/Total/Max): 176MB/188MB/1038MB

You have plenty of memory so maybe you should start looking at a network issue.

Gerry

[vividweb]

I am seeing similar issues when moving between screens, when I try to play a show the audio starts and I can see video playing in the preview window, but the menus stay up for about 30 seconds to 45 seconds.

I have my heap set to 1024. I didn't notice this until I replaced my server with a much faster and new win 7 box. Never had any issues on my older slower server. I am thinking it is a setting somewhere that I had switched on the old box, but just can't figure out what. I see this on all my extenders (300's and 200's). I have Diamond installed, but have not tried removing it yet to see if it is the cause or not.

[PeteCress]

Originally Posted by gplasky

No change in what? The symptoms? Because according to the log file you now have a maximum jvm of 1038MB and you're only using 176MB

Symptoms.

Yeah, that was bothering me - but nobody said anything about a registry setting or execution-time parm to set "used".

Sounds like I need one.

?

[tmiranda]

Pete,

You probably want to edit your post with the system information and remove your IP address and locator ID.

Tom

[PeteCress]

Originally Posted by tmiranda

You probably want to edit your post with the system information and remove your IP address and locator ID.

Done: both posts.

Thanks for looking out for me!

[PeteCress]

Originally Posted by vividweb

I am seeing similar issues ...
I have my heap set to 1024. I didn't notice this until I replaced my server with a much faster and new win 7 box....

Just realized I've been holding out on one thing: I did not mention that my system drive is an Intel SD card.

Changing from a hard drive to the SD card was the biggest overall performance increase I've ever experienced, but for an individual application... who knows..... ?

Any possibilities there?

[PeteCress]

Originally Posted by gplasky

You have plenty of memory so maybe you should start looking at a network issue.

I'd be the last one to claim that I understand my network or that it's 100%.

Having said that....

Wouldn't it beg the question of why I get the pause in PlaceShifter even when it is running on the server box - yet no pause when I am running under the server application on the same box?

[PLUCKYHD]

Do you use native resolution switching? I have noticed slowdowns on my hd300 with the latest firmware. I don't see it on my other hd300s that don't do native switching.

[tmiranda]

If these slowdowns are limited to the extenders and the placeshifters I'd start by thinking about what they have in common. The biggest thing is that they do a lot of the UI processing on the server. One of the things that happens in that case is that the UI is rendered to various tempfiles. You also mentioned that you have a SSD as the system drive. How big is it? Are you running low on space? Do you watch online videos? (There is a quasi-bug in Sage that often leaves watched online videos orphaned in the temp directory.) Check the size of the temp directory to see if there are lots of files in there. (And if you set your online videos temp location to something other than the default look in there too.)

The speed of the SSD should make up for any slowdowns due to fragmentation or "disk nearly full" conditions, but you never know.

I'm grasping at straws but like I said, I'd start thinking about what extenders and placeshifters have in common (and the server and SageClients do not share.)

Tom

[PeteCress]

Originally Posted by tmiranda

...The biggest thing is that they do a lot of the UI processing on the server. One of the things that happens in that case is that the UI is rendered to various tempfiles. You also mentioned that you have a SSD as the system drive. How big is it? Are you running low on space? Do you watch online videos? (There is a quasi-bug in Sage that often leaves watched online videos orphaned in the temp directory.) Check the size of the temp directory to see if there are lots of files in there. (And if you set your online videos temp location to something other than the default look in there too.)

The speed of the SSD should make up for any slowdowns due to fragmentation or "disk nearly full" conditions, but you never know.

Both the System and Data partitions on the SD card are approximately 1/2 full.

Just on GPs, I cleaned out the "Temp" directory pointed to by XP's "Temp" and "TMP" environment variables - no change.

But it seems like it's still possible that somebody, somewhere has been pointed to their own idea of "Temp" - which might be on a network share.
In support of that theory, I just flipped between some screens on an HD200 and checked the recently-cleaned-out Temp directory - and found nothing in the way of tempfiles.