Closed Caption Problem

[FriscoJohn]

I'm having a problem with Closed Captions on Sage (V7, lastest version). Closed captioning works OK on OTA broadcast signals but on Comcast the captions display erratically. Typically a few lines will display correctly, then there will be multiple lines of random characters, eventually cycling back to correct display.

This is on all Comcast channels, including the OTA channels in the cable lineup. Interestingly, Windows Media Center handles the cable CC without error.

I'm currently using HDHRPrime for my cable channels but noted the same problem when I was using QAM (before Comcast encripted all of those). I,m using SageTV MPEG Video Decoder for the MPEG2 Video Decoder Filter with DXVA enabled and Microsoft DTV-DVD Video Decodder as the H.264 Viddeo Decoder Filter and the default VCI video decoder filter.

Anyone having similar problems? Any suggestions as to what to try to address the issue?

TIA.

[FriscoJohn]

Well, apparently no one else has encountered this.

I have tried a couple of things to deal with it and thought the results might be of interest.

According to some old posts, CC was a problem for SageTV V6 and some people fixed it by substituting the video decoder from PowerDVD9 for the SageTV video decoder (in Audio/Video settings). PowerDVD is now up to 13 and the video decoder that comes with it does a great job of displaying the CC in SageTV recordings but when I try to use it as a replacement for the SageTV video decoder I get no picture at all. I'd try the PowerDVD9 video decoder but I haven't been able to find it for download.

One workaround is to record in SageTV and view in WMC which also does a fine job of rendering the CC. Unfortunately, WMC pretends that .ts files don't exist. Oddly enough it plays them fine, but it doesn't add them to it's library of recorded videos which makes it awkward to use it as a player for SageTV recordings. To do so, you have to find the .ts file you want to play in Windows Explorer, right click on it and select WMC as the player.

I have done the registry hack to define .ts files as video which is supposed to make WMC accept them as legitimate videos and catalog them in its library. Didn't work.

Has anyone successfully gotten WMC to automatically add SageTV .ts files to its library?


By the way, I am using HDHRPrime for most of my SageTV recordings and it produces .ts output files. I read that if I changed the mmc..../encode.digital.video.as.program.stream entry from false to true for the HDHRPrime, it would name its output files with the .mpg suffix, which WMC readily accepts. Tried this, couldn't view any video live with this as it produces an error message, "There is no media player available to view this program" (or something to that effect).

I suppose I could go back to the "Dump" option in the HDHRPrime setup which, as I recall, was producing .mpg output files but this doesn't tune a few of the cable channels.

TIA for any suggestions.

[jerryt]

Which video decoder do you have selected in Sage?

What is the make of your video card?

[FriscoJohn]

SageTV MPEG Video Decoder
(DXVA set to "Yes")

NVidia GeForce 9800GT

[jerryt]

Originally Posted by FriscoJohn

SageTV MPEG Video Decoder

Find ATI Avivo download from ATI, install, and set your video decoder to ATI Video Decoder. (Or one of the earlier PowerDVD video decoders)

The issue is with SageTV decoder.

[FriscoJohn]

JerryT:

Thanks for the suggestions.

I've spent two hours googling for a working download link for either of these but no luck. Plenty of google hits but they all prove to be dead links.

Anyone able to point me to a working download link?

[jerryt]

http://drivers.softpedia.com/get/TV-...sta-Win7.shtml
You may need to install ATI card, to get the codec to install...

http://www.skystar.org/index.php?subcat=37

You want
ATI or Cyberlink MPEG video decoder
Set in Sage

[rgroves]

Nice info. I've been wanting to get CC working on my Sage install.

[FriscoJohn]

jerryt:

You were right about needing an ATI card to get the Avivo package to install. I don't have one and it didn't install.

Thanks for the second link which, in contrast to about 30 others I tried, actually worked. I was able to download PowerDVD8 (couldn't find PowerDVD9--the one that is said to have an outstanding video decoder--on the site). Installed the video decoder from the PowerDVD8 package in Sage to replace the SageTV mpeg decoder and saw a major improvement in Sage's handling of closed captions. The first five channels I tried played flawlessly without any garbling of the captions. Unfortunately, I did find a few channels--e.g., AMC-HD--that still don't play well with Sage as far as the closed captions go, even with the new PowerDVD8 decoder installed. WMC plays the captions on all channels without a glitch. If I could figure out what mpeg video decoder WMC is using I would try installing that in Sage.

If anyone knows of a (real, actually working) download link for PowerDVD9 please let me know as I would like to try that version of the Cyberlink decoder to see if there is any further improvement over PowerDVD8.

To sum up, I now have functional closed captions on most channels in SageTV which means I won't have to resort to using WMC as a player for SageTV recordings most of the time. This is a major improvement.

Thanks much, jerryt!

Oh, by the way, the video decoder from the current Cyberlink product, PowerDVD13 crashes SageTV so that's a no go. (Apparently between PowerDVD8 and PowerDVD13 something major changed.)

[jerryt]

You can use WMC's video decoder in Sage, but it will not provide any CC

Because WMC uses it's own closed caption display filters (Like post processing filter), they are not part of the video decoder.

What you have is probably as good as it gets. You could borrow an ATI video card, install it, and get the ATI Avivo package to install. They are equal to PowerDVD latest video decoder.

I believe the latest PowerDVD decoders have to be hacked, or simply registered with Windows Directshow engine in order to work.

To verify the CC data, download CCextractor and drag a recording from AMC HD on top of CCextractor. It will create a .srt file in that same directory. Drag the .srt file on top of Notepad, the closed captions will open as a text file. See if the captions are displayed in the text file corrected. IF NOT THEN NO VIDEO DECODER (Except WMC) will display them correctly.
If the caption are correct in the text file, you can set up CCextractor to process all your recording and create .srt files. Then in Sage you turn CC (or subtitles) on... and Sage will use these .srt files. This is how I had been doing CC. But the captions get out of sync with the video a lot.

I was only using the ATI Avivo codec for live TV, everything else was CCextracor, .srt files, and settings in Sage.

Currently I am only using WMC do to copy protected channels

[FriscoJohn]

Thanks, jerryt. Good info.

[FriscoJohn]

I realized that another one of my computers had an ATI (AMD) video card so I was able to download and install Avivo per jeryt's link above. I then located the mpeg videodecoder file from that package, a file named atimpenc.dll and copied it to my HTPC where Sage resides. I replaced the current MPEG2 Video Decoder (Cyberlink PowerDVD8--which was a great improvement over the Sage decoder but still not able to display the closed captions on all channels) with the new Avivo decoder and voila, excellent closed captions on all channels!

Here's step by step instructions on how to install the Avivo video decoder:

Once you get the file atimpenc.dll on your Sage machine, register it. (Easiest way is to use a freeware program called DirectShow Filter Manager (http://download.cnet.com/DirectShow-...-75915498.html). You'll have to right click on the DirectShow Filter Manager icon and select run as administrator to get this to work) Then when DSFManager opens, click on "Register New Filter" and navigate to where atimpenc.dll is stored and follow instructions.)

Next go to Sage Setup>Detailed Setup>Audio/Video>MPEG2 Video Decoder Filter and click on whatever decoder you have currently installed. This will bring up a menu which includes the option "List all decoders". Select this. The new video decoder you have installed will show up on this list as "ATI MPEG Video Decoder". Select this. Exit Sage Setup and you're ready to enjoy your closed captions.

I can't believe I'm finally watching trouble free closed captions on Sage. Is this a great forum or what!

Major props to jerryt for his suggestions and follow-up.

[Gustovier]

Can you guys just post the .dll and then we all use it without needing an ati card?

[FriscoJohn]

Check this out:

http://dllsource.com/dhtmlfiles/atimpenc.dll.html

Cheers.

[KryptoNyte]

Has anyone ever had issue with CC getting out of sync when playing your media with an extender (HD300 for example)? I have a few TV programs and movies encoded with Handbrake with the CC intact. The CC plays fine on SageTV Client on a computer, but gets out of sync after it's enabled on the HD300.

I can disable and re-enable it, but after a few minutes, it gets out of sync again.

[Zogg]

First, thanks for the information in this thread. I had tried a lot of combinations of decoders and renderers to get captioning working with SageTV 9 OS, including the ATI decoder listed here, to no avail. But after some trial and error I got a solution that is similar to what's described earlier so here are a few notes.

First, the MainConcept MPEG2 decoder does work with captions, but is $50. I tested it but don't plan to use it. Their H.264 decoder does not work with captions, at least not for me.

Second, as I mentioned, the ATI decoder linked to here didn't work for me, but I found one that does. I downloaded one of the last Catalyst driver packages that included AVIVO, 10.7, and installed it on a Win7 x64 system. Among the install files I found two folders, AVIVO and AVIVO64. I was then able to install the decoder onto a Win7 x32 system (already running Cat 15.7.1) using the installer in the AVIVO folder and it works fine. I upgraded the x64 desktop back to Cat 13.9 (older card) and the ATI decoder still works fine there.

BUT - on the x64 system I have to use the VMR9 renderer, where on the x32 system I can use EVR. The only caveat with using VMR9 is that the only H.264 decoder that works is the Microsoft DTV-DVD Decoder. I get a black screen trying to use other H.264 decoders.

Finally, I can't find any decoder that will show captions for my HDPVR H.264 recordings. I don't have too many H.264 files nor do I use the HDPVR much, but it would be nice to have.

[Tiki]

Originally Posted by Zogg

Finally, I can't find any decoder that will show captions for my HDPVR H.264 recordings. I don't have too many H.264 files nor do I use the HDPVR much, but it would be nice to have.

You won't find one - the HDPVR doesn't capture closed captions unless they are being displayed by your STB while the recording is being made. They are not capturing the original digital stream, they just get the analog output from your cable box and then re-encode it as a digital file.

[Zogg]

Originally Posted by Tiki

You won't find one - the HDPVR doesn't capture closed captions unless they are being displayed by your STB while the recording is being made. They are not capturing the original digital stream, they just get the analog output from your cable box and teen code it as a digital file.

You're right, I should have realized that.

[gordyp]

I have been having sporadic luck with Closed Captioning in my recordings using the PowerDVD 7 and 8 decoders - it seems that some stations' captions are rendered better than others, but all of the files that have problems in Sage seem to work fine in VLC so the CC data is there. I have followed the steps from this thread to load and register the ATI/AMD Decoder DLL, but all I get in Sage is 'ATI MPEG Video Multiplexer', 'ATI MPEG Video Encoder' and a couple of irrelevant ones. All of my video cards are ATI/AMD - that's all I use. I tried installing the Avivo software referenced here, as well as my last Catalyst package - no help there either. What is really irritating is that I have an old box with a v.7 install of Sage that was upgraded to V.9 on a box that has had several AMD cards installed in it, which actually has a working ATI MPEG Video Decoder (and the CCs show up fine) , but apparently does not have atimpenc.dll on it that I can find (it does have atimpenc64.dll, but no help there either) - which brings me to my question. Is there any way to determine the file(s) that this install of Sage is seeing and ID'ing as an ATI MPEG decoder? Thanks!

(Edit) After much tinkering, I was finally able to get the atimpenc.dll file from my other system (version 12.5.0.30429) installed and registered so Sage could see it...

[FriscoJohn]

Glad you sorted it out gordyp.

Just for reference, in attempting to answer your question,"Is there any way to determine the file(s) that this install of Sage is seeing and ID'ing as an ATI MPEG decoder?", I searched my sage.properties file and found the ATI decoder referenced in this line:

videoframe/video_decoder_filter=ATI MPEG Video Decoder

I assume this line is where you would look to see which video decoder Sage is using. It doesn't, however, give you the file name associated with that decoder.


Incidentally, in Sage's [Detailed Setup] [Video/Audio] setup screen the ATI decoder is shown as follows:

[MPEG2 Video Decoder Filter] ATI MPEG Video Decoder

Cheers.