Moved to MythTV

[amt]

I would not say I am 100% done, but I am functional. For a little while I was running Sage and Myth backend on the same server at the same time (splitting up the HDHR's). I have a Acer Revo nettop for one "extender" for the bedroom and I just built a more heavy-duty extender for home theater. All of this was functional in about a week of working on it in my spare time. Some thoughts:

-MythTV is much more complicated to configure, in spite of a lot of work to simplify this for users. There are Linux distributions custom built for Myth, which is fantastic, but there are still a ton of options configure, many hardware specific. This is really more of an issue for the frontend boxes (the "extenders"). All of this is documented, but it can be a bit overwhelming. The Myth distro's are a great start, but IMO, it really needs more of an "appliance" approach, where many of the HW specific options can be pre-configured. Would be great to see flavors for specific nettops.

-It is Linux, and if you are not used to that, it may be more of an issue for you. That was not really an issue for me.

-HD HR's just work, and that is great. I have not tried anything else (don't have anything else). Myth appears to support the HD-DVR thingy, so maybe some day I will give that a shot some day.

-MKV rips of blu-rays play. I have not been able to get dts-hd or truehd to "pass-through", in spite of a supported graphics card with hdmi (Nvidia gt430 in the the home theater "extender"). However, these soundtracks do appear to be decoded properly (I purposely removed the "core" dts/dd tracks in these rips, so I -think- it really is decoding the HD tracks).

-Audio/video sync: I seem to have some issues with these going out of sync once in a while. The jury is still out on this. I have a feeling this has to do with getting some setting just right, and in spite of my researching this quite a lot, I must not have hit to right combination. You can manually adjust the delay for audio at any time, which helps, but that is not a real solution. This seems to be more of a problem on my beefier HT "extender" and on blu-ray MKVs -may be only with the HD audio codecs, not sure.

-I use "schedules direct" for EPG, about $20/year. Seems to work fine for me.

-There's a very large community out there, which is great.

-Commercial skip works great.

-There's really no fear of MythTV "shutting down". The source code is not going away, and you are not locked in to specific hardware.


Overall I am pretty satisfied, but I still have some things to resolve before I am 100% happy. Anyone else tried MythTV?

[jchiso]

I tried MythTV at least three times in the past. It's always been too complex and performed poorly. I've been using various Linux desktop systems for over ten years now, but it seems like it's still too complex. Looking at your list of issues I would still not attempt to use it, since I would need it to support an HD-PVR and can't live with audio sync issues.

I realize folks are always working to make things better and more intuitive, but unless they can come up with a real appliance-grade implementation I'll steer clear ...

[davephan]

I would like to try MythTV. I have a second computer identical to my SageTV computer for testing. I have heard that is a royal pain to get running. Once you got it working, is it stable? No stuttering, no lockups and nothing abnormal? The audio/video sync problem sounds disturbing. Maybe that is an isolated or systemic problem. Does MythTV have intelligent recording scheduling, where it learns what you like and don't like? Are their Favorites and Anti-Favorites? Or, do you have to schedule everything manually? Will the EPG work only with a $20 a year subscription ($20/year is not expensive)? Is the EPG guide accurate and functional? The web site said it can stream Netflix, how well does that work? It sounds like you don't need a third party software package like "Playon" for Netflix to work. Can you watch delayed "Live TV", or do you have to wait for the recording to be completed before watching it? If you stop a recording and start it, are you given the option to 'resume' or 'start from the beginning'? What do you use to monitor the recordings so that they are automatically processed by Comskip or some other commercial detecting software? What software are you using on your 'extender' computer? Does the 'extender' computer allow you full functionality like a SageTV extender, or limited in some way like only playing back recorded content?

What are the things that are missing from MythTV when you compare it to SageTV? What does MythTV have that are missing in SageTV?

Have you tested a backup and recovery with the MythTV server? I also own the SageTV Linux version. I am able to easily recover it in about ten minutes using Clonezilla, which is a free disk imaging software package that works with Linux. The commercial Linux imaging software costs about $600 or more. If you haven't tested a disaster recovery, maybe you could try that with Clonezilla. Try recovering to a 'test' hard drive just in case the recovery fails.

One of my concerns was that the forum seemed to be like a third party forum, not a forum by the same MythTV organization. I briefly checked the third party MythTV forum; it seemed to be very tiny compared to the SageTV forum. Do I have the correct impression of the MythTV third party forum? The forum is critical to future growth and user support of MythTV.


Dave

[SWKerr]

Originally Posted by davephan

I have heard that is a royal pain to get running. Once you got it working, is it stable? No stuttering, no lockups and nothing abnormal? Dave

I await more recent feedback on this. I have not played with MythTV in a few years but unless something has changed the answer to this question would be no. MythTV stability is a Myth.

You can download a MythTV distro that helps make it easier to setup but any kind of trouble shooting requires you to get into the weeds. You really need to understand Linux\Unix or you will get very frustrated.

Linux media\video support is still some what lacking. Great server software. Free and stable.

[gtfreymann]

I used MythBuntu for about a year, server with one satellite receiver in the basement, and a frontend/backend with the other satellite receiver in the living room, a third frontend in the bedroom and a fourth frontend in the office.

Overall I'd have to say it worked great for us! I even added some X10 Home automation commands and a web page to control our lights accessible from anywhere (with a password of course).

I use a MCE IR Blaster/Receiver on the backend to change channels.

This was back in Mythbuntu 7.10 days and I don't recall having to fiddle much with it once it was up and running.

The hardest thing on all my setups (except WMC) was getting the blasters to change channels on the receivers.

We switched to Vista Media Center because I wanted to lose the noisy big computers and use extenders. Then the extenders were no longer supported and one stopped working so I switched over to SageTV.

Our SageTV has a main server in the basement with both dish receivers connected to it. We have a Zotac MAG screwed into the back of our LCD TV in the living room, a HD300 in one bedroom, and a small footprint computer in the master bedroom.

We are very happy with our SageTV system and now I'm left wondering where we go from here too.

I would consider going back to MythBuntu actually... but I will most likely play with MediaPortal on a spare box first, *IF* we find SageTV becomes stale with no more support, etc.

[PiX64]

im def. not bailing on sage at all. I am sticking with them until the bitter end if that even ever comes, but in the mean time i like many here like to tinker. So i am going to start playing with this:

http://www.mythbuntu.org/

[ThePaladinTech]

Originally Posted by gtfreymann

Our SageTV has a main server in the basement with both dish receivers connected to it. We have a Zotac MAG screwed into the back of our LCD TV in the living room, a HD300 in one bedroom, and a small footprint computer in the master bedroom.

I'm curious what Zotac Mag do you have? and how do you rate it's performance compared to your HD-300?

[PiX64]

Originally Posted by PiX64

im def. not bailing on sage at all. I am sticking with them until the bitter end if that even ever comes, but in the mean time i like many here like to tinker. So i am going to start playing with this:

http://www.mythbuntu.org/

Just found this too which is interested because win 7 is pretty awesome and for someone that doesn't like to tinker with linux all the time you could go this route on client machines


http://www.hackourlife.com/perfect-m...ac-using-xbmc/

[gtfreymann]

Originally Posted by ThePaladinTech

I'm curious what Zotac Mag do you have? and how do you rate it's performance compared to your HD-300?

I have the Zotac MAG Mini All-ini-one Giant. That's all they call it, but it does come with different configurations. Here's what I have:

NVidia ION Series processor with DirectX 10 support
Intel Atom 230/330 CPU (dual core with hyper-threading, appears as 4 cpus)
Win7
2 GB DDR2 Memory
160GB Sata Internal HD
Onboard Gigabyte LAN (this is what we use)
Onboard 802.11n Wifi (we never use this)
VGA and HDMI outputs
Optical S/PDIF output

I used an external USB DVD to install the OS.

Got it from newegg.ca for $399 CDN including taxes and shipping, and that the was Zotac Mag HD-ND01 along with the external DVD and a USB
Modem.

I use the HDMI out and since I was previously using the S/PDIF output on the previous computer I continued to use that going into a Yahama surround sound amp.

The Zotac performs well. It doesn't have any problems playing HD videos. I do find moving around the menus to be a bit sluggish but compared to the HD300 it works just as well.

It's small and as I mentioned, I mounted it to the back to the TV so it's out of sight and it barely makes any noise at all. We have a cheap logitech wireless keyboard and mouse connected to it, which we keep hidden behind the TV when not being used. We have a Windows MCE remote to control the unit.

We power it off when not in use (sleep mode) and reboot time is probably less than 30 seconds coming back from sleep mode. It needs a complete reboot every now and then and I find it gets slower when I use the desktop and then go back into sage so I usually reboot it when I'm done.

Overall, it gets high marks / praise from me, and I wouldn't hesitate to purchase another.

[amt]

Originally Posted by davephan

I would like to try MythTV. I have a second computer identical to my SageTV computer for testing. I have heard that is a royal pain to get running. Once you got it working, is it stable?Dave

So far zero issues on the backend. Just today my wife called me and told me the frontend in the bedroom stopped. She said there was "a bunch of text on the TV". This was the terminal I had running, where I launched the frontend program. I instructed her over the phone to run the command again, and she was fine. FWIW, I do plan to avoid situations like this, I just need to spend a little more time ensuring the frontend restarts properly. I am not sure the program even crashed; I think she may have accidentally exited out of it. Keep in mind, I have every intention of making this wife-acceptable!

Originally Posted by davephan

No stuttering, no lockups and nothing abnormal? The audio/video sync problem sounds disturbing. Maybe that is an isolated or systemic problem.

The only time I notice stuttering was when X was not configured properly for Myth. I had to turn off a couple things, and it was just fine. This usually has to do with turning off features for desktop use, like animated icons, extra fancy graphics features, etc, that are never used within Myth.

Originally Posted by davephan

Does MythTV have intelligent recording scheduling, where it learns what you like and don't like? Are their Favorites and Anti-Favorites? Or, do you have to schedule everything manually?

I am not sure if it can figure out what you like, IMO, I never cared for that feature (in any DVR) anyway. It does do favorites (records automatically), and has a lot of options, some might say too many! You can even write your own custom recording rules, but I have not done that (and would like to avoid it). It does appear to get a "season pass" or "favorites" or whatever you want to call it, and do things like limit it to one episode per day/week (or not) and not record duplicates.

Originally Posted by davephan

Will the EPG work only with a $20 a year subscription ($20/year is not expensive)? Is the EPG guide accurate and functional?

I think $20/year (under $2/month) is very reasonable. So far it seem accurate. There is a way to do this at no cost, for local channels only, using some sort of info that's broadcast through those channels. The data is usually only for the next few hours, so not that useful, but better than nothing. I quickly moved to the schedules-direct service.

Originally Posted by davephan

The web site said it can stream Netflix, how well does that work? It sounds like you don't need a third party software package like "Playon" for Netflix to work.

I have not tried Netflix of any online videos. That is definitely one thing I have been wanting to try.

Originally Posted by davephan

Can you watch delayed "Live TV", or do you have to wait for the recording to be completed before watching it? If you stop a recording and start it, are you given the option to 'resume' or 'start from the beginning'?

You do not have to wait. Not sure about the resume. I know you can bookmark the videos, not sure if they automatically place a bookmark if you stop in the middle.

Originally Posted by davephan

What do you use to monitor the recordings so that they are automatically processed by Comskip or some other commercial detecting software?

I don't really monitor them, but perhaps there is a way. Enabling commercial detection is as simple as selecting a check-box. There is no extra configuration to get it going. There are a bunch of controls over this once you have it enabled. I -think- there's a way to do this to recordings in progress, so that if you hold of on watching a little while, then commercials can already be detected and skipped during your delayed playback -however I have not confirmed this.

Originally Posted by davephan

What software are you using on your 'extender' computer? Does the 'extender' computer allow you full functionality like a SageTV extender, or limited in some way like only playing back recorded content?

Linux + MythTV frontend is the software, in the form of "MythBuntu". There is no limitation, you can watch live TV, pull up EPG, change channels, add recordings.

Originally Posted by davephan

What are the things that are missing from MythTV when you compare it to SageTV? What does MythTV have that are missing in SageTV?

Honestly they are very close in features. One of the things I did not like about a Linux Sage server was the comskip required using a MS program, which I guess is possible with Wine, but I did not want to there, so I never had comskip.

Originally Posted by davephan

Have you tested a backup and recovery with the MythTV server? I also own the SageTV Linux version. I am able to easily recover it in about ten minutes using Clonezilla, which is a free disk imaging software package that works with Linux. The commercial Linux imaging software costs about $600 or more. If you haven't tested a disaster recovery, maybe you could try that with Clonezilla. Try recovering to a 'test' hard drive just in case the recovery fails.

I don't see how this would be any different for Myth. There are probbaly some alternatives for Myth, as you probbaly just need to backup the database (mysql) and some confguration files if you do not want to do a full backup of the system.

Originally Posted by davephan

One of my concerns was that the forum seemed to be like a third party forum, not a forum by the same MythTV organization. I briefly checked the third party MythTV forum; it seemed to be very tiny compared to the SageTV forum. Do I have the correct impression of the MythTV third party forum? The forum is critical to future growth and user support of MythTV.

The real forum is actually an email list and not a web based forum at all, so it makes sense that whatever forum you may have been looking at doe snot seem like the official one.

[panteragstk]

Originally Posted by PiX64

Just found this too which is interested because win 7 is pretty awesome and for someone that doesn't like to tinker with linux all the time you could go this route on client machines


http://www.hackourlife.com/perfect-m...ac-using-xbmc/

Mythbox is pretty cool. The recordings view sucks, but the basic functionality is there.

[PiX64]

Originally Posted by panteragstk

Mythbox is pretty cool. The recordings view sucks, but the basic functionality is there.

Is it a viable replacement for an extender though? that's the big question on my mind right now. Im doing a mythbuntu install inside of win 7 right now because i don't feel like re-partitioning, and such. We shall see how it goes.

Have you tried mythbox live cd?

[panteragstk]

Originally Posted by PiX64

Is it a viable replacement for an extender though? that's the big question on my mind right now. Im doing a mythbuntu install inside of win 7 right now because i don't feel like re-partitioning, and such. We shall see how it goes.

Have you tried mythbox live cd?

I haven't actually tried any of them, but looked at the youtube "demo". It looks like it is very basic functionality and would work on "extenders". I don't really plan to look at alternatives in depth until sage stops working to a point to where I can't fix it with a plugin or something else. I don't see that happening for a very long time.

[benjamintm]

I tried Mythbuntu a couple weeks ago. The biggest problem I had was that it took 40+ minutes to run a channel scan during setup. That was on one tuner of one HDHR. I dreaded the idea of doing it all six HDHR tuners (3 boxes). Is there a shortcut? That is assuming you have an HDHR.

Thanks,
Ben

[panteragstk]

Originally Posted by benjamintm

I tried Mythbuntu a couple weeks ago. The biggest problem I had was that it took 40+ minutes to run a channel scan during setup. That was on one tuner of one HDHR. I dreaded the idea of doing it all six HDHR tuners (3 boxes). Is there a shortcut? That is assuming you have an HDHR.

Thanks,
Ben

Couldn't you just duplicate the lineup like sage? I really hope it can at least do that.

[davephan]

Thanks for all the answers!

The free EPG does not seem viable since the data into the future is so limited. How far in the future does the Schedules Direct information go?

Can the commercial skipping be applied to only commercial channels with the MythTV checkbox?

I'm still not clear what type of client you are using. It sounds like MythTV has a client mode. From your report, it sounds like the recordings do not have stuttering or other ill effects that would make the software totally unusable.

I downloaded and burned the MythTV Ubuntu 11.04 32-bit and 64-bit ISOs. I will try running the CDs on my test computer with a HDHomerun. I will check out MythTV soon.


Dave

[amt]

Originally Posted by benjamintm

I tried Mythbuntu a couple weeks ago. The biggest problem I had was that it took 40+ minutes to run a channel scan during setup. That was on one tuner of one HDHR. I dreaded the idea of doing it all six HDHR tuners (3 boxes). Is there a shortcut? That is assuming you have an HDHR.

Thanks,
Ben

Not sure why that would take so long. I think it took maybe 2 mins to scan, and I don't think I had to scan for each HDHR tuner.

[davephan]

I installed the Mythubuntu X64 version on the test computer. I haven't been able to figure out how to add the HDHomerun to it yet. There is a "setup" menu option, but nothing in there about adding tuners. I selected the "backend" and "front end" installation option.

My HDHomerun does work if I launch the HDHomerun application. However, I don't see how to add the HDHomerun to MythTV.

Dave

[panteragstk]

Originally Posted by davephan

I installed the Mythubuntu X64 version on the test computer. I haven't been able to figure out how to add the HDHomerun to it yet. There is a "setup" menu option, but nothing in there about adding tuners. I selected the "backend" and "front end" installation option.

My HDHomerun does work if I launch the HDHomerun application. However, I don't see how to add the HDHomerun to MythTV.

Dave

Here ya go. http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Silicondust_HDHomeRun

[davephan]

Thanks for the link. That looks pretty horrible compared to a GUI to simply add a tuner.

Dave