Concerned about Sage's Future

[pjpjpjpj]

I don't argue that it's not a "geek" product. Anyone who would start the process of looking for a PC-based software (and/or hardware) system to perform as a DVR/PVR would have "a little geek in 'em".

But it also doesn't HAVE to require inordinate climbing on the house, cutting/patching of drywall, purchasing of materials, work and re-work on things such as creating your own custom-length network cables (i.e., you can buy pre-made), etc. It CAN... but it doesn't HAVE TO. As I mentioned, I had a LOT of the stuff required laying around my house, including the server PC. In fact, that was a big reason why I chose SageTV in the first place.

As to your point of "why does my PC have to be on?", I doubt that anyone that clueless would ever get to the point of having SageTV installed on a PC in their house. I'd think if you were savvy enough to go online, find the product, see what it does, and purchase it, then you would have at least read enough about it to know the general concept of what it requires. I'm probably wrong (I see in the news every day how I underestimate the stupidity of the general public), but I like to kid myself anyway.

[bebopblues]

SageTV will never be like Tivo, very unlikely, mainly because it does so much more than Tivo. And because it is so comprehensive in features, that also makes it much more complicated to set up.

I don't see how they can make the product easier to setup unless they sell the server hardware itself. It will be preconfigured to work out the box like Tivo. You just need to plug the TV cable in and run a setup onscreen to configure your WIFI and EPG, then fire up the extenders with WIFI and enjoy.

As for SageTV's future, I'm guessing they are doing well. I don't think they will grow into a giant fortune 500 company, but probably do well enough to stay in business for a long time.

This user forum is one of SageTV's strongest point, it doesn't matter if you are new or experienced, just ask if you don't understand something, and the users here are ready to help explain to you in plain english.

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by bebopblues

SageTV will never be like Tivo, very unlikely, mainly because it does so much more than Tivo. And because it is so comprehensive in features, that also makes it much more complicated to set up.

I don't see how they can make the product easier to setup unless they sell the server hardware itself. It will be preconfigured to work out the box like Tivo. You just need to plug the TV cable in and run a setup onscreen to configure your WIFI and EPG, then fire up the extenders with WIFI and enjoy.

As for SageTV's future, I'm guessing they are doing well. I don't think they will grow into a giant fortune 500 company, but probably do well enough to stay in business for a long time.

This is the key reason they had proposed the 'server on a stick' architecture. As a way to provide relatively turn-key capabilities to 3rd party hardware vendors. That concept, it seams, has been abandoned (or at leastn ot mentioned in an official context in almost a year).

[PGPfan]

As usual Fuzzy, you are right about the 'server on a stick' idea. It IS a sound idea, but the implementation would be troublesome at this point in my opinion. I'd imagine just a hand full of us forum regulars would adopt it - making it an even smaller subset of the Sage/Linux group - and so the forum would be of little help with issues. And as you know the Linux version is officially an OEM product, so no support is available there.

Makes sense to me as to why it's seemingly been abandoned - it really doesn't have a logical place in their roadmap, imho.

-PGPfan

[JetreL]

Am I the only one that thinks the "Server on a Stick" is an absolutely horribly idea? Depending on sales from the support aspect Sage would have to add many more Georges and become much more snappier about there responses.

I don' think they have the marketing budgets, the supply chain, or the operating budgets to handle a growth of that type. Not to mention the product would have to be so watered down that it would loose or at least alienate their current customer base. We (or I) like SageTV because of the functionality and versatility.

When you start dealing the the general population, the product needs to work, be simple and at a price point that is cheap. They have missed the boat with DVRs being the buzz word so they cannot demand a premium for their product so they would have to make up for that by sheer numbers and subscription fees. Who here really wants that. Heck we even debate an incremental upgrade fee.

[mickp]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

This is the key reason they had proposed the 'server on a stick' architecture. As a way to provide relatively turn-key capabilities to 3rd party hardware vendors. That concept, it seams, has been abandoned (or at leastn ot mentioned in an official context in almost a year).

Aye. I wrote an empassioned (probably drunken iirc) post a while back on the possibilities for a turn-key system here.

I think it would be awesome if SAGE turned its attention to this next.


Mick.

[reggie14]

I still think configuring, maintaining, and troubleshooting SageTV systems is far more complicated than the actual installation. I have a hard time imagining recommending a SageTV server-on-a-stick system to someone that I didn't think would be perfectly fine with a regular Sage install. OTA TV is fairly easy, but dealing with ever-changing QAM channels is no fun. Going through the setup procedure selecting which channels you get and don't get is no fun. Dealing with cable TV tech support during outages when your set top boxes are all hooked up to your SageTV server is no fun. In general, I think working with STBs can, on occasion, be a bit of a pain. Software updates seem to occasionally turn off my STBs, although that only seems to happen about once a year.

And, as I said in another thread, heaven forbid someone actually runs into a problem and needs tech support. I'm mostly happy with the combination of official email support and unofficial forum support, but I don't think you'd be able to market something like Sage to regular consumers without at least some form of telephone support.

In theory server-on-a-stick is a fine idea. While I probably wouldn't use it, I imagine some techies would find it useful for various reasons. But, I just think there are more important things to do. Namely, in spite of the updated UI in v7, I still think it needs a lot of work, particularly on the music and imported video side. I'd rather see Sage try to work with an HCI expert to develop a new interface. Apparently they originally tried that with v7, and it didn't go so well, so they ended up doing the UI updates themselves.

[tmiranda]

The Linux version of Sage is specifically called "Linux OEM" because it can be used by entreprenenrial companies to create "pre packaged" Sage devices.

[Spectrum]

Originally Posted by tmiranda

The Linux version of Sage is specifically called "Linux OEM" because it can be used by entreprenenrial companies to create "pre packaged" Sage devices.

Exactly! If you want to see a "Server on a Stick" YOU make it, package it, market it, sell it, and support it. That last one is where it breaks down for me. Sage has provided you with all the tools you need, including Studio to stamp your own info into the UI. There's a business oportunity here for anyone with the money and wherewithall to try it

[panteragstk]

To me sage is like home automation software, except htpc front ends are fewer (I think) than the amount of HA products out there. The reason I think of sage like HA is the simple fact that it is a small group that would actually want the functionality of HA or sagetv. Granted when we show our systems to relatives they think it is neat, but would you want to set up a sage system for your parents? No because you become their support. To get a similar product that has pre-built systems and phone support you would have to get a kaleidescape system that has less functionality and costs way more, but it would be easy to maintain because it is a closed system. Start integrating that system into tv and music and everything else and you have an entire HA system on your hands that costs multiple thousands of dollars. No thanks.

I'll keep sage the way it is.

[nick_l]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

This is the key reason they had proposed the 'server on a stick' architecture. As a way to provide relatively turn-key capabilities to 3rd party hardware vendors. That concept, it seams, has been abandoned (or at leastn ot mentioned in an official context in almost a year).

Shhhh! Don't remind them.

[mitchedo]

While I am a geek, and I am learning to love my SageTV, Had Microsoft come out with their family Live Gold account last August instead of January this year, I most likely would have gone with Windoze Media Center. The only extender available for MCE is the Xbox, and without Live Gold, you can't watch Netflix. I couldn't see buying an Xbox and not being able to watch Netflix on it. All I would've needed for MCE was one XBox at $199 (already have 2), so the initial cash outlay would've been a couple of hundred bucks less than Sage.

Of course, there's the whole issue of having to deal with DRM with MCE, and the fact that I can't set MCE to record based on bandwidth, (or to multiple hard drives?) but those are geek concerns, not mainstream concerns. Granted, I never tried to watch TV over the XBox, so maybe that would've given me some sort of fit.

MCE just worked. I didn't have to do anything to make it work. I have spent nigh unto 6 months trying to get SageTV to work properly. I'm almost there.

SageTV is, and probably always was, a niche geek product. ...and I hope that niche will sustain them. The HD300 is TERRIFIC!!!! I just wish Netflix was integrated.

[ayjax]

I too tried BeyondTV and Myth before settling in to bed with SageTV. I origianly started with 6 and I too felt the OP's pain on configuring things to get it to work properly (was soo frustrated at times I almost gave up and just got a DVR). But the thing that kept me going was the user support here on the forums. So thanks to all of you! I also didn't want to be limited to the number of channels I could record at the same time. Now that I have upgraded to 7 it is quite an improvement over 6 especialy the mod engine (Although I wish there was a way to see what mods were newly added since the last time I checked the screen). The WAF factor is very hi with STV7 as well, so double thanks!

I cant see that non-geek people would even be interested in using a product like Sage as they would have to install tuner cards etc into their PC and to do things like that you have to at least a have a little geek in you I would think.

Anyway, just my 2 bits.

[Brent94Z]

Originally Posted by ayjax

(Although I wish there was a way to see what mods were newly added since the last time I checked the screen).

Sort by Date Added.... puts the new ones at the top

[ayjax]

Originally Posted by Brent94Z

Sort by Date Added.... puts the new ones at the top

You da Man!