HDHomerun tired of missing recordings because of comcast channel moves any suggestion

[jhughesjr]

Hey folks,
Every couple of weeks I miss a recording or two because comcast changes their digital lineup and I need to rescan in HDHomerun and sagetv but don't realize it until after the recording is missed. The rescan in HDHomerun, verify changes, restart SageTV and remap is getting tedious, I would like to think that Sage or SiliconDust are working on a way to automate this process, or at least parts of it. Anyone have any suggestions on how to detect these changes and force the rescans prior to missing the shows short of a solution for SD or Sage?

Cheers,
Joe

[Fuzzy]

I think there are just far too many markets for sage or silicondust (or even zap2it) to deal with internal reconfigs of channel freq's. The actual channel lineup (the logical channel number for each channel) usually doesn't change. Basically, the way to avoid the constant remaps, is to use a STB, which DOES get updated immediatly when the CableCo moves channels around. Use the HDHomeRun for OTA, which also, never gets moved around.

[loomdog32]

unfortunately, thats the nature of QAM.

It would be like complaining about the speed limit on a street that kept changing. It just happens....


Things to look for, adding a new channel, announced "improvements", announced "down time"... Those are usually indicators of possible QAM changes. Anytime these happen, its best to rescan (what youll find may surprise you -example: ComCast Fresno had unannounced SF locals on clear QAM for awhile that were never part of the official lineup).

[sandor]

i just shake my fist out the window at the big building below every time it happens:

[stanger89]

The problem is, I believe, that the actual channel mapping data is not in the normal QAM band. IIRC the early prototype pictures of the HDHR Prime showed an OOB (Out Of Band) tuner specifically for the channel mapping info required for QAM.

[jasonl]

One of the people on our forums created a tool that checks for lineup changes - http://www.silicondust.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8841 .

The only in-band data on Comcast is the data used by the DTA system, which is helpful for channel numbers, but uses different channel names than TMS. It also only contains information for channels available on the DTA, so no HD channels. Our lineup server does use this information to help numbering on Comcast systems.

Jason
Silicondust

[jhughesjr]

Hey folks,
Thanks for actually responding and being able to decrypt my sort of cryptic message there. If you folks use HDHomerun with Sage you probably feel my pain. . Thanks for sending me that link Jason, I'll definitely check it out. I understand that the ultimate solution is for the government to crack down on these monopolies and open their systems up which is probably never going to happen. I was just hoping that Sage or SD would be working on something to make it a little more user friendly. I think the barrier for entry to support this type of setup is a little bit higher than an average user, my wife loves Sage but the odds of her ever being able to use it successfully are less than none. Don't get me wrong, I love Sage been using it since 2004 I believe it was the 2.x platform back then. Two things that would make things better for me would be:
1 - Be able to enter an email address or cell phone number to allow sage or SD to send emails or text messages when an issue occurs, this would allow me to know sooner rather than later when a recording error occurred.
2 - When a recording fails have Sage automatically try one of the other channels to record it, granted I might loose a minute or two of the show but that is better than loosing the whole thing. For example, on my lineup I currently have 3 ABC channels, one HD and two analog and historically Comcast seems to juggle their HD more than their analog ones, would be nice if Sage tries the HD one first, if that fails immediately try one of the other ones to see if it can record from there.
3 - Oh yeah one more thing, host some sort of community site that allows people to upload and share the channel info and have SD and/or Sage have an integrated interface to retrieve this info. That way if my market changes and I go through the remappings and rescans and verification of the channels I can then post that to the community so that someone else from inside of Sage and HDHomerun can easily download and save the updates. I understand that it is too much for Sage, Zap2It, and SD to support all the markets but would be great if they could enable the community to support their own markets.

[Fuzzy]

Y'know, even if all that WAS done, you're still at the point now where ClearQAM isn't really an option for anything by Locals (SD Versions of them in most markets). It's simply not a reasonable options anymore, and I certainly wouldn't recommend anyone go that route. Even if they DO still have some basic cable lineup channels in the clear now, it'll probably not be that way for long. The reasoning for the removal is theft of service. Cable Companies would much rather be able to leave the cable hooked up to every residence, and just use activation and encryption to determine if you are capable of getting service.

I'm also pretty sure the monopoly is already broken. The exclusive right-of-way agreements between local municipalities and cable co's have been broken down, allowing competing companies to move in (like FiOs and UVerse).

[jhughesjr]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

I'm also pretty sure the monopoly is already broken. The exclusive right-of-way agreements between local municipalities and cable co's have been broken down, allowing competing companies to move in (like FiOs and UVerse).

I have to disagree regarding what I consider to be monopolistic practices, I understand some areas are now getting fios (i'm not) but all the companies are running on closed systems, it's like years back when AT&T used to make you rent or buy their phones specifically because they claimed they were the only ones that would work reliably on their systems. If the government did to the cable companies what they did to the electric companies, made the cable companies open up their pipes and protocols and allow anyone to deliver content over their pipes I can't even imagine how much innovation we would see in the industry.

[jreichen]

Originally Posted by jhughesjr

1 - Be able to enter an email address or cell phone number to allow sage or SD to send emails or text messages when an issue occurs, this would allow me to know sooner rather than later when a recording error occurred.

Sage creates system messages when recording errors occur. The Web Interface plugin has a page to display system messages and a link on there for an RSS feed. Also check out the Sage Alert plugin, it forwards system messages using several notification methods.

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by jhughesjr

I have to disagree regarding what I consider to be monopolistic practices, I understand some areas are now getting fios (i'm not) but all the companies are running on closed systems, it's like years back when AT&T used to make you rent or buy their phones specifically because they claimed they were the only ones that would work reliably on their systems. If the government did to the cable companies what they did to the electric companies, made the cable companies open up their pipes and protocols and allow anyone to deliver content over their pipes I can't even imagine how much innovation we would see in the industry.

that is not monopolistic, at&t and verizon have decided at this point it wouldn't be worth the infrastructure costs to move to your area. as for others using the existing cableco's lines, they are
1: probably nearly full
2: private, so the government cant FORCE them to open thing
3: already carrying an open channel used for internet traffic, fully available for your 3rd party innovation.

also realize that you have no 'rights' to tv beyond what the FCC already makes in the clear, over the air. anything beyond that is a private contract between you and whatever private company you are dealing with, if they choose to keep that secure, they have just as much right to do so as you have rights to stop paying them and spend your money elsewhere.

[lotusvball]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

I'm also pretty sure the monopoly is already broken. The exclusive right-of-way agreements between local municipalities and cable co's have been broken down, allowing competing companies to move in (like FiOs and UVerse).

Actually no the right of way agreements have not been broken down. I live in an area where fios has stopped because there are too many municipalities and verizion has halted trying to get agreements for now. It is too much work for the revenue they would be receiving. So comcast still has a monopoly on my internet access. I am duping their cable this weekend, but I have no choice for high speed internet. Sounds like a monopoly to me.

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by lotusvball

Actually no the right of way agreements have not been broken down. I live in an area where fios has stopped because there are too many municipalities and verizion has halted trying to get agreements for now. It is too much work for the revenue they would be receiving. So comcast still has a monopoly on my internet access. I am duping their cable this weekend, but I have no choice for high speed internet. Sounds like a monopoly to me.

not quite. what i was referring to was in the past, part of the comcast right of way agreement with the city would have included terms that prevented the city from permitting any competitor a right of way. those provisions have been shot down nationwide. and yes, while in your area, comcast has a monopoly, it is NOT due to monopolistic tactics. they were just there first, so anyone coming in later has more competition to get enough customers to make the investment worth it. Not all monopolies are illegal. there is also nothing comcast is doing that is preventing you from ussing your phoneline for your internet either. why arent you complaining about your phone company not offering comparable internet?

[jasonl]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

Y'know, even if all that WAS done, you're still at the point now where ClearQAM isn't really an option for anything by Locals (SD Versions of them in most markets). It's simply not a reasonable options anymore, and I certainly wouldn't recommend anyone go that route. Even if they DO still have some basic cable lineup channels in the clear now, it'll probably not be that way for long. The reasoning for the removal is theft of service. Cable Companies would much rather be able to leave the cable hooked up to every residence, and just use activation and encryption to determine if you are capable of getting service.

The only cable company that has gotten a waiver to stop sending locals in the clear is Cablevision, and only in the City of New York (the Bronx and 2/3 of Brooklyn are the only areas covered). They only managed to get this because the 100 year old rats nest of cables found at the top or bottom of every building in NYC makes it almost impossible to figure out what goes where and stop theft. This same excuse won't apply to other areas with more modern wiring and more spread out populations.

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by jasonl

The only cable company that has gotten a waiver to stop sending locals in the clear is Cablevision, and only in the City of New York (the Bronx and 2/3 of Brooklyn are the only areas covered). They only managed to get this because the 100 year old rats nest of cables found at the top or bottom of every building in NYC makes it almost impossible to figure out what goes where and stop theft. This same excuse won't apply to other areas with more modern wiring and more spread out populations.

Sorry, that was a typo.. It should have read ClearQAM isn't good for anything BUT locals..