Inconsistent TV audio volume

[aflipz]

I've had sagetv for years, this has always irritated me but finally enough so for me to rant about it;

Q6600 quad core
4gb ddr2 ram
GTX 260 gpu
HVR1600 tuner

Using SPDIF out into an HD tv with built in 2.0 speakers and NO intention of going 5.1...

When I watch anything in HD I have to turn the volume WAY up just to be able to follow conversations etc. Problem is, every time the feed changes to SD (for commercials, or when an HD show ends and an SD show begins) The audio BLASTS out of my speakers enough to REALLY irritate me.


Why does it do this? (seems to have something to do with the way sage plays 2.0 audio vs 5.1)

WAY more importantly; how do I fix this, and why is this not handled automatically? It's simply unacceptable as it is...


I tried fooling around with the settings in ac3 but success has been mitigated and I don't really know what I'm doing in there...

[MrFusion]

Originally Posted by aflipz

When I watch anything in HD I have to turn the volume WAY up just to be able to follow conversations etc. Problem is, every time the feed changes to SD (for commercials, or when an HD show ends and an SD show begins) The audio BLASTS out of my speakers enough to REALLY irritate me.
..

Hi,

I have the same issue with an HD200.

Worked around it by using the volume control on the sage remote to reduce playback volume to, say, 15%.

Then crank up the volume on the TV to hear the HD content properly.

Seems that the sage volume only affects SD, not HD, content. So using the above reduces SD volume enough to match HD volume.

Don't know if this helps in your case. <muttering darkly>Probably some undocumented tweak in the sage.properties file which fixes this anyway...</muttering darkly>.

Good luck!

[aflipz]

Thanks MrFusion,

The sage volume control does affect my HD audio as well as SD so that workaround won't work for me, It might be helpful for others though until a true fix is found.

I forgot to mention my OS and sound card;

Windows 7 Ultimate (authentic, not demo) and the onboard audio of my P5Kc mobo. Also, sound is carried from SPDIF, into gtx 260's input then carried to the TV via HDMI, and finally but probably totally irrelevant; 500gb caviar black drive.


A small variation I could live with, but this is ridiculous;

An AC3/192Kbps@48kHz Stereo at my TV's "level4" is considerably louder than a AC3/384Kbps@48kHz 5.1 at the tv's "level8"

Something needs to be done to bump the sound level of the 5.1 up to the Stereo's level because any other audio file plays at roughly the same volume as Sage's 48kHz Stereo.

[blade]

It annoys me as well, but I don't think it's Sage's fault. I see the same thing with cable boxes.

The reasons why this occurs has been discussed numerous times here on the forums. If no one posts with a technical explanation you should be able to find one with a search.

I agree it would be great if Sage could address it somehow.

[Fuzzy]

In your case, since it's the AC3 that is being sent both ways to your TV, then it honestly sounds like a problem in how your TV is mixing down the 5.1 sound. Since you're only using a 2.0 setup anyways, I'd just chance the way AC3Filter is configured to output 2.0 PCM. This will allow AC3Filter to do the downmixing (which does a much better job at it anyways), and even allow you to use some auto volume leveling within the filter.

Basically, in AC3Config, set the output to 2/0 - stereo, 16-bit PCM, Use SPDIF checked, AC3/DTS/MPEG Audio passthrough unchecked, and Use AC3 encoder unchecked. This should cause ac3filter to decode anything passed to it, and downmix it to stereo pcm. It will then send that stereo PCM out your SPDIF port to the TV.

[aflipz]

Fuzzy, that seems to have "normalized" the output considerably! There is small variation as I switch between two channels of different type but I don't have to crank up the volume to hear 5.1 broadcasts loud and clear. No more stereo commercials blowing out my windows in the middle of a 5.1 broadcast!

I can't thank you enough!

[MrFusion]

Nice one, Fuzzy!

Anyone know why there's such a significant volume difference between SD & HD playback on the HD200s, and, more importantly, how to fix it?

Cheers!

[Fuzzy]

I'm guessing most of this is actually at the head-end.

[MitchSchaft]

That's the nature of HD audio, folks. It used to be a big complaint at thegreenbutton.com back when I used windows media center, too.

[Fuzzy]

it's also why many tv's and receivers include some level of auto volume regulation in them.

[MitchSchaft]

I just didnt want folks blaming Sage .

[MrFusion]

Hmmm...

So, HD volume is low, SD volume is high.

I can "match" these by simply turning down the volume on the HD200 (so its same as HD), and then using volume on TV. No probs switching back and forth etc.

Then the kids get to it...

So, any way I can lock in the SD volume at a particular value?

Cheers!

[ccsmoke]

Dolby claims their new technology will fix this very problem. Basically they claim to able to use complex algorithms in real time to monitor and compensate it. The previews at CES looked very encouraging.

http://www.dolby.com/consumer/unders...by-volume.html

[jgscott987]

Average conversations and sounds are set low on HD recordings so that there is enough headroom to create massively loud sounds like explosions. If conversations were set close to the maximum volume available (as they are on SD channels), explosions would be at the same volume as a loud conversation.

On a related note, my set-top box has a setting for audio dynamic range, with the options of narrow, normal, or wide). If I set that value to normal or wide, the volume on the recordings is very low. Narrow sounds like it would adversely affect the audio quality, but narrow is actually what we are all used to. Narrow is the default on the set-top box, which surprised me until I figured out the ramifications of changing it.

[Comitizer]

Originally Posted by ccsmoke

Dolby claims their new technology will fix this very problem. Basically they claim to able to use complex algorithms in real time to monitor and compensate it. The previews at CES looked very encouraging.

http://www.dolby.com/consumer/unders...by-volume.html

I believe Windows 7 does this already. If you view the properties for your sound device, you can switch to the "Enhancements" tab and select the "Loudness Equalization" option.

It works quite well as long as you're not doing 5.1 (in my setup anyway).

Anyone know of a way to script this so that I can turn it off an on with a button click in Sage? ;-)

[sic0048]

Originally Posted by MrFusion

Hmmm...

So, HD volume is low, SD volume is high.

I can "match" these by simply turning down the volume on the HD200 (so its same as HD), and then using volume on TV. No probs switching back and forth etc.

Then the kids get to it...

So, any way I can lock in the SD volume at a particular value?

Cheers!

Don't use the SageTV remote. Instead get a programmable remote and train it to learn the SageTV remote command, but use the TV volume commands instead of the SageTV volume control. That way there is no way someone could change the SageTV volume unless they got out the Sage OEM remote (from where you hid it) and used that.