HD HomeRun Announces DLNA Live TV Digital Media Server

[NetworkGuy]

I saw this announcement from Silicondust. http://www.hdhomerun.com/company/news/

I was wondering if that would enable SageTV to directly access "cable card" channels on a Prime unit.

Has anyone looked into this?

Thanks,
John

[Fuzzy]

Not really. The DLNA server is still encrypted via DTCP-IP.

[MattHelm]

Does it record. I don't think I could ever go back to "Live" TV. I'd give up HD first!!!

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by MattHelm

Does it record. I don't think I could ever go back to "Live" TV. I'd give up HD first!!!

It is assumed it would still function as a standard HDHR as far as sage is concerned (meaning copy-freely only). But the DLNA aspect of it is only used for streaming live.

[Skybolt]

It acts as a DNLA server and has aclunky menu/guide to select channels with. It should work with pretty much any tv that supports DNLA. As fuzzy noted it is encrypted, so for now it doesn't give you any more channels then SageDCT can.

My Sharp and Samsung both work with this. No big deal though.

It would be nice if some company would pickup up the DTCP protocol and implement a DVR with it. It may be too cost prohibbitive for a small company to do this though.

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by Skybolt

It acts as a DNLA server and has aclunky menu/guide to select channels with. It should work with pretty much any tv that supports DNLA. As fuzzy noted it is encrypted, so for now it doesn't give you any more channels then SageDCT can.

My Sharp and Samsung both work with this. No big deal though.

It would be nice if some company would pickup up the DTCP protocol and implement a DVR with it. It may be too cost prohibbitive for a small company to do this though.

Currently, I think the only DTCP-IP certified device is the PS3.

[reggie14]

It only encrypts the copy-protected channels, right?

I kind of wonder if this could provide an alternative to the SageDCT method for using the HDHR Prime with SageTV. It sounds like some people have problems with recording halts.

[Skybolt]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

Currently, I think the only DTCP-IP certified device is the PS3.

Yes, but the DNLA part of non encrypted channels comes through as such. I tried the PS3 as well, but still no big deal.

[Skybolt]

Originally Posted by reggie14

It only encrypts the copy-protected channels, right?

I kind of wonder if this could provide an alternative to the SageDCT method for using the HDHR Prime with SageTV. It sounds like some people have problems with recording halts.

From what I can tell, So far I can only watch the same channels availabe as SageDCT or CopyFreely. To support DTCP would cost more then a few dollars. Form what I have read it is quite expensive to buy in. Mayb Fuzzy knows more.

[reggie14]

Originally Posted by Skybolt

From what I can tell, So far I can only watch the same channels availabe as SageDCT or CopyFreely. To support DTCP would cost more then a few dollars. Form what I have read it is quite expensive to buy in. Mayb Fuzzy knows more.

Sure, I was just talking about Copy Freely channels. From what I understand SageDCT isn't as reliable as other recordings methods. I wonder if using DLNA would provide a more reliable recordings method for Sage.

And I suspect licensing fees are just one of the challenges associated with DTCP support. At this point I don't see how it would be possible to implement DRM support into Sage. Even if you could license DTCP, you couldn't make the necessary changes to the SageTV server or extender code.

[Fuzzy]

Yeah, Extenders are the component that are keeping DRM out of SageTV at this point. DRM should be possible on a client, as long as the system supported some level of directshow filter (it would seriously limit your processing capabilities, and decoder/renderer choices, but it is at least possible). The HD100/200 are no chance, but the HD300's controller actually DOES have encryption key capabilities in it, and it COULD have been made DRM capable - not that it's going to happen now.

The best way to get premium content in sage, is to simply get it via a method that removes the encryption methods. R-5000HD or Component video capture are really the only options.

[Tiki]

Originally Posted by reggie14

From what I understand SageDCT isn't as reliable as other recordings methods. I wonder if using DLNA would provide a more reliable recordings method for Sage.

Well, I guess nothing is foolproof, but I've been using Sage for a long, long time with a lot of different tuners and so far the only one that has been 100% flawless is Sage-DCT with an HDHR-Prime. So, I would have to disagree with that statement. I'm sure that some people have run into issues with Sage-DCT, but the same can be said for every type of tuner.

[nyplayer]

I too have found SAGEDCT %100 reliable once I optimized my server and network.

As far as DLNA goes I am currently beta testing it on my android Nexus 7 so far SD no problem HD not so much.

[Skybolt]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

Yeah, Extenders are the component that are keeping DRM out of SageTV at this point. DRM should be possible on a client, as long as the system supported some level of directshow filter (it would seriously limit your processing capabilities, and decoder/renderer choices, but it is at least possible). ...

I thought that DRM was not needed if DTCP was implemented over DNLA, because of certificates across your private network?

[Skybolt]

Originally Posted by nyplayer

I too have found SAGEDCT %100 reliable once I optimized my server and network.

As far as DLNA goes I am currently beta testing it on my android Nexus 7 so far SD no problem HD not so much.

Yeah, all of the premium content/HD in general won't pass. What are you testing, the HDHR Prime? What do you think so far? Still pretty basic so far.

[Skybolt]

Originally Posted by reggie14

... From what I understand SageDCT isn't as reliable as other recordings methods.

I had SageDCT workng pretty well, you need tohave your network finely tuned as mentioned. I have my Video network physically seperated from the rest, only connected at the gateway router.

I wonder if using DLNA would provide a more reliable recordings method for Sage.

I would think it is easy to implement this through a plugin much like TubeCore or PlayOn does for 7MC.

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by Skybolt

I thought that DRM was not needed if DTCP was implemented over DNLA, because of certificates across your private network?

The content can still only be received via a DTCP-IP compliant DLNA renderer. For sage to be able to record it, then it would have to get and handle the key properly from the key issuer (the HDHomeRun, in this case).

[reggie14]

Originally Posted by Skybolt

I thought that DRM was not needed if DTCP was implemented over DNLA, because of certificates across your private network?

A device implementing DTCP can't store content unprotected. So, you would need to implement DTCP-IP between the HDHR and the SageTV server. Then the Sage server would need to store the content wrapped using an approved DRM scheme. Then I guess you could either use that DRM scheme on the extender, or use DTCP between the server and the extender.

[Skybolt]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

The content can still only be received via a DTCP-IP compliant DLNA renderer. For sage to be able to record it, then it would have to get and handle the key properly from the key issuer (the HDHomeRun, in this case).

I didn't think DRM applied to DTCP, they talk about certificates on devices and locked to the local network, or not outside of your local network.

I totally understand DRM but doesn't DTCP replace DRM?

EDIT: Or are you saying sage would have to be able to enforce certificates? Which obviously cannot happen at this point?

[Skybolt]

Originally Posted by reggie14

A device implementing DTCP can't store content unprotected. So, you would need to implement DTCP-IP between the HDHR and the SageTV server. Then the Sage server would need to store the content wrapped using an approved DRM scheme. Then I guess you could either use that DRM scheme on the extender, or use DTCP between the server and the extender.

Crap, I missed this. So DTC-P via transport, but DRM on th eendpoint device. So how can it be possible for a nas box be DTCP complient and store recordings and still be watched else where?