Just in case- Alternatives to SageTV

[SHS]

Originally Posted by valnar

There is a long thread on AVSForum about Moxi and people over there are saying Moxi is a dead product too. Development has stopped. They are just selling the remainder of their inventory. (Not a bad idea. Sage? hint, hint)

Moxi was long dead before it even got started the fact wasn't it very expandable and over price and limited number of tuner oh has no input analog support

[Skirge01]

I posted this is another thread, but here's what I'm currently doing.

First, I've installed XBMC on my client PC to familiarize myself with it.

Second, I've imported my rips, from the same folder Sage currently points to, without any issue. The XBMC scrapers were able to pull in the fanart and metadata pretty easily.

Third, and this is where the issues start, I'm trying to get my TV Shows into XBMC. Since XBMC doesn't have a PVR yet, I'd continue using Sage as the back-end. This would require that I fire up Sage in order to schedule recordings/favorites or watch LIVE TV (or I may directly hook up a STB for LIVE TV), neither of which are a big deal.

Getting the files to show up was easy, however, the scrapers are having issues with the SageTV filenames. Because I don't want to stop using Sage just yet, I'm wasn't willing to rename the files and, due to space, I'm not willing to duplicate them. Even if I could get them to show up with fanart, etc, I can't mark them as watched in Sage, nor can I delete them from the Sage DB. So, the next thought was this:

Again, schedule recordings via SageTV. Set up SJQ to mark all recordings as watched immediately after the recording finishes. Allow comskip to complete, as well. Then, (need to figure out how to do this, but...) set SJQ to make the recordings imported media and probably use the XBMC python script from bradvido to rename the files so XBMC can import them successfully.

Assuming I can do the above, this approach would allow me to watch the shows via XBMC, delete them, and then SageTV would notice the missing files on its next library update and delete the entry from its own DB, keeping everything clean.

[clayfree]

Originally Posted by Skirge01

I posted this is another thread, but here's what I'm currently doing.

First, I've installed XBMC on my client PC to familiarize myself with it.

Second, I've imported my rips, from the same folder Sage currently points to, without any issue. The XBMC scrapers were able to pull in the fanart and metadata pretty easily.

Third, and this is where the issues start, I'm trying to get my TV Shows into XBMC. Since XBMC doesn't have a PVR yet, I'd continue using Sage as the back-end. This would require that I fire up Sage in order to schedule recordings/favorites or watch LIVE TV (or I may directly hook up a STB for LIVE TV), neither of which are a big deal.

Getting the files to show up was easy, however, the scrapers are having issues with the SageTV filenames. Because I don't want to stop using Sage just yet, I'm wasn't willing to rename the files and, due to space, I'm not willing to duplicate them. Even if I could get them to show up with fanart, etc, I can't mark them as watched in Sage, nor can I delete them from the Sage DB. So, the next thought was this:

Again, schedule recordings via SageTV. Set up SJQ to mark all recordings as watched immediately after the recording finishes. Allow comskip to complete, as well. Then, (need to figure out how to do this, but...) set SJQ to make the recordings imported media and probably use the XBMC python script from bradvido to rename the files so XBMC can import them successfully.

Assuming I can do the above, this approach would allow me to watch the shows via XBMC, delete them, and then SageTV would notice the missing files on its next library update and delete the entry from its own DB, keeping everything clean.

You might want to try out MediaPortal, there is a plugin that is supposed to make them work together.

http://www.team-mediaportal.com/plug...al-integration

I have not tried it so please post if it's any good.

Also once you get xbmc setup have a look at the IceFilms plugin

[reggie14]

Originally Posted by SHS

Moxi was long dead before it even got started the fact wasn't it very expandable and over price and limited number of tuner oh has no input analog support

The apparent lack of interest by the new owners of Moxi is troubling, but the capabilities look pretty good to me. I don't think the price is that bad, particularly when you take into account the lack of a monthly fee. Three tuners is really plenty for me- I don't think I ever use more than that at once. And the storage space is expandable via external drives.

The lack of analog TV support would have been limiting before, but I'm in an all-digital market now.

[wayner]

Originally Posted by Skirge01

Getting the files to show up was easy, however, the scrapers are having issues with the SageTV filenames. Because I don't want to stop using Sage just yet, I'm wasn't willing to rename the files and, due to space, I'm not willing to duplicate them.

Wouldn't it be better to use Sage generated metadata files like .properties or .my files in XBMC to read in metadata that was in Sage? Can XBMC read in these types of files? If not perhaps an XBMC developer or a (former) Sage plugin developer could perhaps write such a plugin for XBMC. You could have SJQ generate .properties files the moment that a Sage recording starts so that you could perhaps even handle Sage files that are still recording. Better yet, perhaps XBMC could read the metadata that Sage started embedding in the Recording files starting in V7 - but this might not work for rips.

With this methodology perhaps you could essentially use XBMC as a front-end to a Sage server with most Sage capabilities, perhaps including guide data, etc - by using the Sage API.

FYI - here is what a .properties file looks like:

Description=Needs are the order of the day. After taking care of some gardening needs, we help Mr. Salt and Mrs. Pepper, who need to know which fruits to wash for their fruit salad. Later, we help out with Steve's need to have his clothes clean and in order when Blue gets into them and they get messed up. Then we skiddoo into a picture of a beach where we help Starfish who needs to get to the ocean to get cleaned off.

Director=Matt Sheridan

EpisodeName=What Does Blue Need?

EpisodeNumber=5

Genre=Children

Guest=Cecilia Gonzalez

Guest=Cecilia Gonzalez;Annie Hagg

MediaProviderDataID=76536

MediaProviderID=tvdb

MediaTitle=Blue's Clues

MediaType=TV

OriginalAirDate=844574400000

RunningTime=1800000

SeasonNumber=1

Title=Blue's Clues

UserRating=70

Writer=John Morning

Year=1996

Year=

ParentalRating=TVM

SeriesInfoID=189504

Actor=Cheryl Blayloc;Christiana Anbri;Cody Ross Pitts;Donovan Patton;Jonathan Press;Julia Wetherell;Kathryn Avery;Kelly Nigh;Patrick Van Wagenen;Sean Hanley;Spencer Kayden;Stephen Schmidt;Steve Burns;Thomas Sharkey;Traci Paige Johnson

[kricker]

Originally Posted by clayfree

You might want to try out MediaPortal, there is a plugin that is supposed to make them work together.

http://www.team-mediaportal.com/plug...al-integration

I have not tried it so please post if it's any good...

I posted a bit about this earlier. So far the MediaPortal TV sever setup has been futile. Channel scanning and mapping is frustrating at best.

[matterofrecord]

Originally Posted by matterofrecord

I'VE THOUGH OF A REALLY GOOD ALTERNATIVE TO SAGE.

What would happen if all the tuner manufactures got together and got behind one unified project

Originally Posted by Karride

Sure, great idea. I've had one too; What if everyone got a free Unicorn on their birthday this year?

I got a free unicorn for my 30th birthday. It tasted great. No wonder they're practically extinct.

[brainbone]

Originally Posted by clayfree

There are even some PVR builds for the AppleTV that appear to be working. The one drawback is that Mpeg2 decode appears to limited(it plays any mpeg4 with ease, even 1080p) so I don't understand how I could ever play OTA astc.

Not sure if anyone has put this to into use, but something like the following could work to get Mpeg2 going on AppleTV2, provided it was able to handle the relatively high bit rate stream that would be produced:
https://investigacion.uclm.es/docume...14235-p931.pdf

[Skirge01]

Originally Posted by clayfree

You might want to try out MediaPortal, there is a plugin that is supposed to make them work together.

http://www.team-mediaportal.com/plug...al-integration

I have not tried it so please post if it's any good.

Also once you get xbmc setup have a look at the IceFilms plugin

I checked out MP first (okay, maybe 2nd) and didn't really like what I saw. I actually do NOT want to give up SageTV at this point, which I'd need to do in order to use MP. Right now, I think the best option is what I'm working on: using SageTV as the PVR back-end and using XBMC as the front-end. I'll continue following the XBMC PVR development, but I think that's a long way off still. We have at least a year of EPG data and Slugger already has an EPG replacement "ready".

In the mean time, we continue using SageTV's UI and I can continue getting XBMC working flawlessly with SageTV as the back-end. Once I'm satisfied, the household can switch over. That may not even be for another year. But, at least I'll be ready.

[SJL]

Originally Posted by kricker

I posted a bit about this earlier. So far the MediaPortal TV sever setup has been futile. Channel scanning and mapping is frustrating at best.

Hey Kricker,
I'm going to be experimenting with MediaPortal for the first time this weekend - one item I noticed was the scheduling is simplistic compared to Sage - then I saw the supposed solution to that is a plug-in called ForTheRecord. Did you see that or happen to try it by chance? It looks like it can control the tuners and replace the TV server in MediaPortal completely.

[Korny]

I must say I'm really surprised I haven't seen much mentioned about MythTV, its got a lot of features built in that sage needed plugins for (transcoding, comercial skipping/cutting, job que's) I you can build a frontend for ALMOST the same price as an HD extender(150 for the n3 box Atom + ion, and a 20 dollar remote, and ram for a total of 180-200), you can network boot it and not even need a hard drive, and no licensing. I'm thinking the biggest hangup is its linux and its TOO customizable, although with mybuntu its a pretty easy setup to get it running basically(assuming the video cards drivers are included in the kernal). It took my 20 minutes to get it installed on my backend, I'm currently running sagetv and mythtv to get ready for my switch over. I guess if you like to tinker and like free stuff, consider mythtv.

[reggie14]

The TiVo Premiere Q (Elite) looks interesting. The Q model, intended for cable companies, is supposed to have an extender-like device called the Preview. Presumably that would mean the Premiere Elite model for sale directly to consumers would also have a Preview-like device.

I haven't used TiVo's very much, but what I have used I've liked. My main problem with TiVo DVRs is that they currently lack a decent way to do multi-room viewing. This might solve that problem. Though, I'm pretty worried TiVo will try to charge a ridiculous amount of money for these things.

[flavius]

I forgot all about them. I used to own a TiVo. If they have extenders now, that may be it: a 4-tuner system with 2 TB OOTB and eSata that you can share around the house. And then add the search across recordings of supported SP's like Netflix and Amazon which would be really nice.

And now that I remember: Using TiVo I will have intelligent recordings again. Sage feature in that department sucks, as you know, it always has.

[checkbin]

Originally Posted by Korny

I must say I'm really surprised I haven't seen much mentioned about MythTV, its got a lot of features built in that sage needed plugins for (transcoding, comercial skipping/cutting, job que's) I you can build a frontend for ALMOST the same price as an HD extender(150 for the n3 box Atom + ion, and a 20 dollar remote, and ram for a total of 180-200), you can network boot it and not even need a hard drive, and no licensing. I'm thinking the biggest hangup is its linux and its TOO customizable, although with mybuntu its a pretty easy setup to get it running basically(assuming the video cards drivers are included in the kernal). It took my 20 minutes to get it installed on my backend, I'm currently running sagetv and mythtv to get ready for my switch over. I guess if you like to tinker and like free stuff, consider mythtv.

Korny, can you provide some details on how you did this? I am Linux savy and would like to look into this as another option for extenders. I hope to run SageTV and my extenders as long as possible, but have to start looking at other long term options. From what I've seen, while MythTV is no SageTV, it does have potential, especially if it can work with some type of low cost extender.

[valnar]

OK, after being in the homemade PVR business for awhile, I should really know the answer to this, but I don't. I've never even loaded MythTV to play with it.

Question: Why isn't MythTV an acceptable alternative once Sage goes away? I rarely see it recommended.

[SHS]

Originally Posted by reggie14

The TiVo Premiere Q (Elite) looks interesting. The Q model, intended for cable companies, is supposed to have an extender-like device called the Preview. Presumably that would mean the Premiere Elite model for sale directly to consumers would also have a Preview-like device.

I haven't used TiVo's very much, but what I have used I've liked. My main problem with TiVo DVRs is that they currently lack a decent way to do multi-room viewing. This might solve that problem. Though, I'm pretty worried TiVo will try to charge a ridiculous amount of money for these things.

Just keep in mind that with lifetime it is $500 which is not really lifetime for the subscriber nor can it cannot be transferred to another TiVo box so another word your SOL meaning ocen your carp TiVo die becuase you don't have any extended warranty plans left after 3 year now really are SOL.

That why us HTPC user are smart we know better then to buy in to TiVo BS we only pay $0 year if it was SageTV or MCE to $20 year for 3rdparty apps for EPG.

Let see even this not out just a best guest
TiVo Premiere Q: $400 to $500
TiVo Preview: $100 (1 Client)
TiVo service Lifetime: $500
3-yr. extended warranty: $40
Subtotal: $1040 to $1140

TiVo Premiere XL: $300
TiVo service Lifetime: $5000
3-yr. extended warranty: $40
Subtotal: $840

TiVo Premiere: $100
TiVo service: $500
3-yr. extended warranty: $40
Subtotal: $640

As of rigth now
No Anlog support
No Extender
No PC Client
Harddrive Expandable blow's and you my as well forget any NAS Box
Video, Music, Pictures area is really poor

There only one good thing I like about the TiVo there Cool Slide Remote

This My idea of real get up go setup
Large Super size server only (Only small handful people will want this option about 5%)
Up to 16 internal tuner expandable module plug in bus
Up to 16 internal harddrive expandable
1 External harddrive expandable option 4/8/16 harddrive expandable case
1 boot drive os
1 DVD/Bluray

Midd size server only (I say 30% of peole will want this option)
Up to 8 internal tuner expandable module plug in bus
Up to 8 internal harddrive expandable
1 External harddrive expandable option 4/8/16 harddrive expandable case
1 boot drive os
1 DVD/Bluray

Small size this is living room stye server + player (I say 65% of peole will want this option)
Up to 4 internal tuner expandable module plug in bus
Up to 4 internal harddrive expandable
1 External harddrive expandable option 4/8/16 harddrive expandable case
1 boot drive os
1 DVD/Bluray

Tuner expandable module option
1: ATSC/QAM Tuner support
2: Cable Card Tuner support
3: Satellite Tuner support (Someday Dishnetwork or DirecTV)
4: DVB
5: Analog coving the fellowing below
Component video input
Optical audio input
Coaxial audio input
Left/Right RCA audio input
Composite video input
S-Video video inputs
HDMI inputs
Channel Blaster support covers all them

Media Player Extender with it coving
Component video output
Optical audio output
Coaxial audio output
Left/Right RCA audio output
Composite video output
S-Video video output
HDMI output

Remote/Keyboard with TV set on and off

Maybe GoogleTV 3.0 Super Software that Server and Client and Phone suppout and god know what else we can dream up.

[SHS]

Originally Posted by valnar

Question: Why isn't MythTV an acceptable alternative once Sage goes away? I rarely see it recommended.

That eazy you need be Linux savy becuase belive me when thing go wrong and they do it real pain in butt to fix's or it real pain butt just get it working where you end putting day's in one problem.

[valnar]

Originally Posted by SHS

That eazy you need be Linux savy becuase belive me when thing go wrong and they do it real pain in butt to fix's or it real pain butt just get it working where you end putting day's in one problem.

It's too bad Mythbuntu or one of the derivatives don't come with a nice self-contained ISO that works "out of the box". One ISO for the server, one for a client. Sounds like a good time for some Enterprising Linux guru to make one. With "official" support, I'd even be willing to pay $30 for such a user friendly version of MythTV, especially considering Sage cost more than that.

[checkbin]

Originally Posted by valnar

It's too bad Mythbuntu or one of the derivatives don't come with a nice self-contained ISO that works "out of the box". One ISO for the server, one for a client. Sounds like a good time for some Enterprising Linux guru to make one. With "official" support, I'd even be willing to pay $30 for such a user friendly version of MythTV, especially considering Sage cost more than that.

My thoughts exactly.

[ranger]

Just for fun I am trying out MediaPortal. No intentions of moving off SageTV, just curious. So far, it is a disaster setting up TV. All I am trying to do is use an HDHomerun on Comcast cable with MediaPortal. So far no joy. I can't even get MP to tune a cable channel. Not a great start.