Why I won't use Sage still...

[debennett2]

life would be so much more simple if people would learn/read before complaining.

Did I resort to personal attacks? I just don;t have time to be involved in the development of every piece of software all the time. On that note, I will take some time to skim the forum for answers to my problems.

[falchulk]

I use myhtpc and exit to it by hitting the power button on the remote! My wife has never had a problem doing that. As a matter of fact, my zoom player, mame, neo geo emulator, and everythign else is configured to exit with....guess what? The power button on the remote.


FYI about the s3 situation.....I have been doing it since around the time I first started suing sage. Thats through 3 diffrent PC's and they all worked without a hitch. They wakeup/record and go back to sleep all day.

[Opus4]

Originally posted by debennett2
"Sleep" just does nothing for me logically..I'm sure it makes perfect sense to those who are regulars in this forum and to the evolution of Sage. I'm starting to wish I had taken more time to be in here as well. Maybe it's not too late....

Rats... I said I was going to find another discussion, but here I am. For a new user (and I see you registered here before I did, so 'new user' may not apply), the key is that there are ways to:

1. completely exit SageTV (don't run full screen; click on the X in the upper right corner; make sure it is set to exit when it receives the Windows Close message)
2. put SageTV to sleep such that it is in the sys tray & still records
3. put SageTV such that it fills the screen with the screen saver & still records

Could the interface be made easier/more clear? Probably, but with all these options, you have to find something that makes consistent sense. Could the manual better describe how to exit/sleep SageTV? Sure, but not everyone reads manauls. So, I don't mean that changes couldn't be made to improve the product; it is just that it is probably hard to get it to the point that it makes perfect sense to everyone w/o anyone needing to read the instructions.

I just can't resist... maybe a button like: "Minimize SageTV to the system tray (that thing in the lower right corner, possibly next to your clock), thus removing SageTV from your view, while leaving it running in order to continue to record your scheduled recordings."

- Andy

[mlbdude]

Originally posted by debennett2
How about "Exit Sagetv Interface"? That makes sense to me. You are not closing Sage but the interface itself. I'd be very happy with that..as well as being able to get rid of the the "music jukebox" and "media library" options as they are redundant to what a lot of folks already have setup...including me. Is it possible to get rid of those two things?

Here is a modified STV. Follow the instructions from my setup page to install it.

http://forums.sage.tv/forums/showthr...&threadid=5229

[Deadbolt]

Originally posted by debennett2
I thought the idea was to forget that fact that we are using a computer...let alone windows. Grandma doesn't care about "Windows".....

If you sleep it to the tray with a menu item named "Close" or "Exit" ... Grandma is going to see Windows pretty darn fast since she will be left looking at the desktop.

[IVB]

Originally posted by Deadbolt
If you sleep it to the tray with a menu item named "Close" or "Exit" ... Grandma is going to see Windows pretty darn fast since she will be left looking at the desktop.

Not if you setup Girder to monitor a On TaskSwitch event and have it automatically pull up myHTPC.

Of course, my bark is much worse than my bite - I've already spent hours analyzing stanger/robogeek/salsbt's GML files to figure out how the heck they got it to work.

But one day it will work, and then Grandma [my MIL], won't be so terrified of our TV.

[debennett2]

If you sleep it to the tray with a menu item named "Close" or "Exit" ... Grandma is going to see Windows pretty darn fast since she will be left looking at the desktop.

The idea is that myHTPC (or whatever) launches Sage in the first place. When Sage is minimized to the desktop, there is myHTPC right where you left off at. You never have to see windows for any reason.

[debennett2]

mlbdude,
Thanks for the file. It works very well! What type of editor is used to manipulate these files? I tried notepad to take a look and just locked up. Thanks!

[justme]

You need Studio to create/edit an STV(their a type of binary file). Take a look at this forum for SageTV Customizations. Look around and read different threads. Also read this thread by Narflex, for your next question.

[laurenglenn]

Originally posted by Deadbolt
If you sleep it to the tray with a menu item named "Close" or "Exit" ... Grandma is going to see Windows pretty darn fast since she will be left looking at the desktop.

How many times have you had a program that would minimize to the system tray when you hit the close button? MSN Messenger does this, as do other programs.

If Grandma doesn't want to see the desktop, don't close Sage.

Women generally hate things that requires us to learn something we can't figure out right away. There's no time to sit down and figure it out; it must be clear and concise from the first day. We generally go off on men who can't ask for directions, but when it comes time for us to have to struggle to figure out the answer, the frustration level rises and it gets thrown away.

Everything always seems to have to be reduced to the lowest common denominator for the WAF. I believe it has something to do with the inability to deal with a situation that's not perfect.

The WAF, as it's called, probably goes out the window as soon as the program crashes once. It doesn't matter if it never crashes again, but you'll always hear about the one time it did.

Look. What's the difference if it goes to the tray when you hit Close or Sleep? Try to exit out of MSN Messenger sometime. When you bring up any Micro$oft program, like Outlook Express, there it is running again. If it hogged up 50% of CPU time, I'd say to add a Close option. But it usually takes up about 1% in modern computers.

Lauren

[mbrown3]

Originally posted by laurenglenn
The WAF, as it's called, probably goes out the window as soon as the program crashes once. It doesn't matter if it never crashes again, but you'll always hear about the one time it did.

I'll have to show my wife that one! So very true...

[debennett2]

Thanks Lauren, I am glad to see someone understands my standpoint. We, atleast the considerate ones, are trying to make this interface so friendly to use that someone that has NEVER used a computer can use it.

I think the only thing stopping me from using SageTV now is the focus issue talked about with myHTPC.

[mlbdude]

Originally posted by debennett2
Thanks Lauren, I am glad to see someone understands my standpoint. We, atleast the considerate ones, are trying to make this interface so friendly to use that someone that has NEVER used a computer can use it.

I think the only thing stopping me from using SageTV now is the focus issue talked about with myHTPC.

Before I moved everything into Sage from myHTPC, I used Girder to handle the focus issue. I think there are a ton of threads on the issue in the forums on how to do it.

[justme]

I think the only thing stopping me from using SageTV now is the focus issue talked about with myHTPC.

What focus issue? MLBDude modded the STV to your request for exiting the SageTv UI. AS for getting back to sage there's always the new -event parameter for the SageTV.exe. By calling "sagetv.exe -event" with the proper # for the corresponding Sage command* you can step right back into Sage from myHTPC. Or are you talking about something else.

*The FAQ has a post with a link to all valid sage commands and their # to be used with the - event paramenter. See the question about SageTV commands and sendmessage.

[debennett2]

Before I moved everything into Sage from myHTPC, I used Girder to handle the focus issue. I think there are a ton of threads on the issue in the forums on how to do it.

I have seen a few of those posts in here. The issue is that this would mean I would need to totally overhaul my already extensive GML I am using. I use a very different logic in order to reuse remote keys on my Pronto. I use the "Is foreground" variable to enable and disable groups. Unfortunately, this is not a question as to what "is foreground" as nothing is. The problem lies in the fact that SageTV does not properly give back focus. Whatever goes on when minimized to the tray needs to be fixed really.
The word on the street is that Sage is much more powerful than before and that there will be the ability to do just about anything you want within it. That is fine and all but I still think they need to realize that some folks will want to use other frontends regardless (don't discount Meedio...trust me). Thanks.

[debennett2]

What focus issue? MLBDude modded the STV to your request for exiting the SageTv UI. AS for getting back to sage there's always the new -event parameter for the SageTV.exe. By calling "sagetv.exe -event" with the proper # for the corresponding Sage command* you can step right back into Sage from myHTPC. Or are you talking about something else.

I'm talking about when Sagetv is minimized to the tray, whatever frontend one is using does not get it back...the frontend is there but one would have to alt-tab or click in order to get one's remote to work again. Using girder events is fine and all but let's look at things this way:

I have navigation buttons on my remote for up down left right etc....right? If I want to use those same buttons over and over again depending on what application I am using, I need to have some sort of logic in girder. At any rate, even if I had girder events for EVERY application I use or even windows messaging (which is what I think you are actually refering to), I'd still be sending the same IR code to ALL applications that use that button that are open. See what I am saying? The problem must be resolved by handing focus back or by having some type of girder event happen and be sent to girder when sage closes/minimizes/sleeps. Make sense?

[Alex0230]

http://forums.freytechnologies.com/f...1062#post21062

You might get away with just copying all the commands from stanger's gml in to your gml and just mapping the buttons. He uses the sendmessage plugin in girder so Sage does not have to have focus, it can be minimized, it can be maximized but behind another window. I found this easiest, just go through the different buttons and "learn" events.

[debennett2]

Alex0230,
I appreciate your efforts at helping but I think you are misunderstanding the issue as well. I AM using the sendmessage deal BUT, in order to keep things simple, one has to enable or disable the ability to control applications based on what one needs to control at the moment (this allows me to reuse the same remote keys on ALL applications/frontends). The only logic I know of that works well across the board is the "is foreground" logic where girder looks for what application is in the foreground and enables a set of commands and disables all others using that same logic. If I have buttons on my remote that all applications use in the same way (like numbers), I exclude them from the logic whenever possible...

[justme]

So it's not Sage focus you're worried about but other apps geting back focus from Sage, correct?

Ok, so when Sage is sleeped you want it to tell girder it is sleeping, and then pass an event to shift focus to another app. That part* should be simple enough to do from Studio, though I admit to being poor at Girder and Studio. However how would Sage know what app to give focus to? Should it just default to myHTPC having focus? This seems like an issue of which program(SageTV/myHTPC) to use as your main control/frontend, given the way you've setup your GML.

*Giving focus to a specific app on SageTV sleep.

[debennett2]

YEs it is a matter of getting focus back. I don't think it is a matter of choosing which app to get focus back to, it's already the ONLY app left to give focus back to logically speaking as it is the only window open at the time. "It" being myHTPC in this case.