"No Signal" on HD programme change with V7

[fac13]

I will have to raise this as a bug, but it might help Sage support to know whether others are also having the following problem: -

When I'm watching live ITV-HD or BBC HD on V7, each time one programme ends and another begins I get a "No Signal" message displayed. Where we used to get "The Pause" in other words. The only way to see the next programme is to return to the Guide and select the channel again.

I have no problems apart from at these programme switch-overs and I don't get it on any other satellite or freeview channels. It happens on my extenders and on a client running on the server.

I had no problems (apart from the aforementioned Pause) at V6, so I'd really like to know whether other UK users running the beta see this too. To reproduce it just select an HD programme from the Guide and watch it until the next programme starts.

My hardware and o/s details are in my Public Profile.

Thanks

[bunch92]

I will test that on my system in the next hour.

What I have noticed is a 1 second black screen when a program changes on non-HD channels . So instead of the pause, I now have a 1 second blank screen. Do you get that on non-HD channels ?

[fac13]

Originally Posted by bunch92

I will test that on my system in the next hour.

What I have noticed is a 1 second black screen when a program changes on non-HD channels . So instead of the pause, I now have a 1 second blank screen. Do you get that on non-HD channels ?

Thanks. No, non-HD programme changes are completely smooth now - I can't even tell it's happening unless I'm watching the progress bar.

Incidentally, I've tried setting always_tune_channel to both "yes" and "no" and the result is the same.

[bunch92]

Just tested HD on BBC HD , and the transition worked ok ( well, apart from a 1 second blank screen like on normal channels ).

I am now a bit puzzled why I am getting that black screen .

To be precise, my test was on an STP-HD200 extender , and I have 2 DVB-S2 tuners on the main server.

[fac13]

All very puzzling, especially as I think we've got the same tuners.

What I see is: Sage creates a new file in my TV recordings folder, but it never writes to it. The client screen freezes with a superimposed "No Signal" message. After about 80 seconds, a -1 version of the file appears and this starts growing straight away, as it should. The client starts playing sound from this but the picture remains frozen.

During the 80 seconds wait, the client log has lots of messages 'VF waiting for data to appear in new file', the sagetvmsgs.log has an entry saying 'The device input Hauppauge WinTV 88x TS Capture Digital TV Tuner stopped producing data', and the main log has two messages which may be relevant: 'FORCE WATCH abandoned because it's currently being recorded' at the time of the switch-over, and 'Async encoder halt detector found a halt; kick the Seeker so it can restart the device' just before the second file is created.

I'll wait and see if I get any more replies before I raise a ticket.

Edit: I'm trying recording two HD programmes back-to-back to see if I get similar results.

[fac13]

Back-to-back recordings look fine, no messages, no -1 file created.

As it only seems to affect clients/extenders and it didn't happen in V6 I guess it's something in the code which was introduced in V7 to try to eliminate The Pause.

It may not have anything to do with the tuner stopping producing data, perhaps it's just that the code which handles the switch from writing to one file to another is doing something wrong, and another bit of code is seeing that the file isn't growing and is assuming it's a tuner fault. I suspect the tuner does in fact keep producing data, but Sage isn't decoding and writing it properly. I'm on Win7 so I'm obviously using different H.264 decoders from you, which may explain why I get this and you don't.

As I said, I'll wait and see if anybody else has the problem.

[bunch92]

Just a quick update to let you know that I do not have a 1 second black screen on my HD200 anymore ( for HD and non-HD ) thanks to a very helpful helpdesk.

I had to set the following in the sage.properties file :

seeker/fast_mux_switch=true

I hope you get your problem sorted too.

Regards

[bunch92]

Tonight I got your issue on BBC HD.

The "No signal" got displayed in the middle of the picture ( with the TV picture still showing in the background ) , and it was stuck there.

I had to exit and reselect the channel to make it work .

So it must be related to the seeker/fast_mux_switch=false/true as I was not getting it before I changed it.

[fac13]

My fast_mux_switch was set to 'true'. As far as I remember I've never edited that one.

I've set it to 'false' and it did change the way the programme change-over was handled, but it wasn't quite I expected from your description. I've only watched one programme change-over with this parameter set, but what I saw was a one second or so step backwards - in other words a small portion of the programme I was watching was repeated. I also got an odd change of aspect ratio, but this was immediately corrected when I clicked on the screen so it may be irrelevant.

I can see no problems being reported in the logs for this period, but there are plenty of messages I don't understand. At least I didn't get "No signal" and have to go back to the Guide, which is a step forward, thank you

I had always_tune_channel set to 'true' from earlier testing and I've decided to set this back to 'false' in the hope this will eliminate the remaining disruption.

Incidentally, I found this old post which describes a very similar problem.

[fac13]

With always_tune_channel=false I get the one second pause you see.

I also got an incorrect aspect ratio switch again; this time I had the picture full screen on my client (running on the server) and it looks like Sage tried to display the 16:9 picture as 4:3. It went back to the correct aspect ratio immediately I clicked on the screen.

Is it ok if I wait and see what Support say to you, or do you think I should raise my own ticket?

[bunch92]

I asked for my support ticket for the 1 second blank screen issue to be closed as I am now getting a smooth transition on non-HD channels.

To be sure it was broken on HD channels, I have just tested again on ITV HD and got the same issue.

If you want to raise it , go ahead , I will raise it too later so they have more details ( I have another outstanding one with them at the moment about aspect ratio while watching DVD folders ) .

[bunch92]

I am going to test the DVB-T HD channel transition between show and will raise a ticket today.

[bunch92]

FYI , same issue on DVB-T HD channels , ticket raised.

[fac13]

Originally Posted by bunch92

FYI , same issue on DVB-T HD channels , ticket raised.

I'm jealous - I wish I could get DVB-T HD channels but of course it's "T2" here and there are no tuners available yet

As I said in my earlier post, trying fast_mux_switch=false improved the HD changeover, but I now see it disrupts the SD changeovers even more - it's almost as bad as the V6 pause.

So, I've returned to fast_mux_switch=true like you were advised to do, and now my SD changeovers are perfectly smooth again and my HD changeovers once again result in "no signal".

I'll be interested to know how you get on with your support ticket.

[bunch92]

My system gets UK DVB-S channels and DVB-T French freeview , so the only HD channel I have on DVB-T is Arte HD , so not worth being too jealous lol .

I will let you know how it goes as we are having the exact same issue.

[bunch92]

I received a new file from SageTV support , and the BBC HD transition worked . I need to do more testing on different channels but fac13 , if you want the file , just send me a PM with your email and I will send it to you so that you can test too.

Cheers

[fac13]

Originally Posted by bunch92

I received a new file from SageTV support , and the BBC HD transition worked . I need to do more testing on different channels but fac13 , if you want the file , just send me a PM with your email and I will send it to you so that you can test too. Cheers

Thanks, I've received the file. I should be able to have a play early tomorrow evening. Way too risky tonight with a Coronation Street about to start, and I have to be up early up tomorrow.

Still would be good to hear from any other DVB HD users on V7 of course ...

[bunch92]

Worked on ITV HD just now , looking very good

[fac13]

Great news, thanks. I've snuck the fix in but didn't get to watch live TV last night, I'll be testing early evening and will report the results.

It's odd this wasn't spotted because I think there were DVB private beta testers and getting rid of The Pause was one of the headline features of this release.

No problem though, this is still very solid code for a beta version.

[bunch92]

I have installed V7.0.10 Beta and replaced the file , and it is working fine for all my HD channels. I am waiting for your feedback and I will then tell SageTV to close the ticket.

Thank you , but a bit strange we are only 2 using V7 beta in the UK .... are people scared to use a beta version ?