How do I get half-hour timeslot resolution for favorite?

[Grant.Edwards]

I'm trying to set up a "favorite" to record a particular show in only
one specific timeslot every day.

However, the SageTV UI seems to assume that all shows are at least an
hour long and start only on-the-hour. That isn't the case. There are
a lot of half-hour shows and shows that start on the half-hour.

How do I configure a favorite to record the 11:00 showing of a program
but not the 11:30 showing? (Or vice-versa -- either one would be fine
with me.)

[paulbeers]

So what you're saying is that the show is really only a half hour, but the guide states it is an hour long?

You could setup a timed recording. I assume you can set those up to re-occur. I have never tried it myself. In that case, you are stating you want Sage to record X channel from X time to X time. The problem with this approach is that it means if it ever moves time slots, the it isn't going to shift to the new time slot automatically.

I suppose you could also adjust the padding to remove the last half hour, anytime it records the show, but again if the guide ever "gets it right", then you will have a half hour show without the last 30 minutes (i.e. no actual recording).

I guess my question is, why does it matter? I had the same problem with "It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia" where the Guide for some reason had it as an hour long show, even though it was two half hour. It wasn't a big deal as I just watched as much or as little as I wanted and then deleted it.

[Grant.Edwards]

Originally Posted by paulbeers

So what you're saying is that the show is really only a half hour, but
the guide states it is an hour long?

Nope.

There are two eposodes of a 30-minute show aired every weeknight. One
at 11:00, one at 11:30.

I only want to record one of them.

But the favorites UI insists that a timeslot is 60-minutes long, so
it records both of them (as separate recordings). I only want it to
record one of them -- either the 11:00 episode or the 11:30 episode.

The EPG info is correct -- it's the SageTV UI that's wrong in assuming
a scheduling timeslot is 60 minutes long. There may be places where
that's true, but it's not true in the US.

You could setup a timed recording. I assume you can set those up to
re-occur. I have never tried it myself. In that case, you are stating
you want Sage to record X channel from X time to X time.

Does that result in the same sort of recording as a "favorite" (program
name, title, details, etc.)?

The problem with this approach is that it means if it ever moves time
slots, the it isn't going to shift to the new time slot automatically.

A favorite constrained to a timeslot won't shift either. However, a
constrained favorite will not record when something else shows up in
the specified timeslot.

I guess my question is, why does it matter?

Because I only want one of the episodes, not both. Sure, I can let it
record both and then delete one of them every day, but that's a hassle.

I'm sure people are sick of hearing this phrase, but...

MythTV didn't have this problem. You could specify that you only
wanted to record a 30-minute program when it occured in a particular
30-minute timeslot.

[paulbeers]

Now I see your issue (but I think you should have been more clear). The issue is that Sage is not recording "an hour" it is recording two half hour shows that are back to back playing the same thing during a one hour time frame....

Basically the EPG is not be differenciating that these are the same shows (i.e. the show ID is either different or missing entirely). This is happens a lot with local programming especially. I guess my question still stands, why does it matter? Sage groups shows into folders that share the same title (i.e. I have about 40 episodes of Seinfeld and all are in the same folder). When you are done watching for the day, you can delete the whole folder at once.

To your notion about Myth does X and Sage doesn't, that is probably true. There are things that they do differently. A couple of years ago I switched from Paint Shop Pro to Photoshop for my photo editing. It was a learning curve and to expect Photoshop to work exactly like Paint Shop Pro would have been assinine on my part. There were a lot of things that I thought Paint Shop Pro did better/easier (except Paint Shop would crash all the freakin' time). In the end, my photos come out so much better because it is a superior product with vastly superior alogrithms (although I admit I probably use about 2% of all the features of photoshop thus making it overkill for me!).

Edit: And I should state, that everyone has a certain need. If MythTV meets your needs and Sage doesn't, it isn't a big deal and stick to what you have. However, if MythTV no longer meets your needs, then please give Sage a real try and have an open mind about how all software has their own "way of doing things"

[Yalbik]

Let me see if I have the situation correct:

- You want to add a favorite for a 30 minute show, which airs at 11:00 and 11:30

- You only want the 11:00 recording

- You've tried to use the favorite -> Advanced Options -> Limit to hour, but that only specifies down to the hour, not the half-hour....

Two options I can think of:
1) Are the two shows on the same channel? If not, you could limit the favorite to a specific channel...

OR if they are on the same channel

2) Try setting the "Stop Padding" on the favorite to -30 minutes (i.e. 30 minutes EARLY). to get the 11:00 show, or the start padding to +30 minutes (i.e. 30 minutes later) to get the 11:30 show. I'm not sure if that will work, but I can't see why not....

[Grant.Edwards]

Originally Posted by paulbeers

Now I see your issue (but I think you should have been more clear).
The issue is that Sage is not recording "an hour" it is recording two
half hour shows that are back to back playing the same thing during a
one hour time frame....

They're not the same thing. They're two different episodes.

Basically the EPG is not be differenciating that these are the same
shows (i.e. the show ID is either different or missing entirely).

No, the EPG is correct.

The problem is that a favorite's time slot constraint only allows
60-minute time slots. I want to constrain the recording to a
30-minute slot. Hence the topic of the thread: how do I get half-hour
timeslot resolution for a favorite?

I'm sorry if that wasn't clear from my orignal posting.

This is happens a lot with local programming especially. I guess my
question still stands, why does it matter?

OK, I'll explain why, but I don't see how it's relevent to the
problem.

The show in question was on for something like 7 years. The station
in question (for whatever reason) airs the episodes in order by
original air-date, but the 11:00 slot is at a different place in the
7-year cycle than the 11:30 slot. For example, the schedule might
look like this:

        11:00  11:30
  ...    ...    ...        
  Mon    #43   #125
  Tue    #44   #126
  Wed    #45   #127
  Thu    #46   #128
  Fri    #47   #129
  Mon    #48   #130
  Tue    #49   #131
  Wed    #50   #132
  ...    ...    ...

I want to watch to watch the episodes in order (no, I'm not going to
explain why I want to watch the episodes in order). So, I only want
to record either the 11:00 slot or the 11:30 slot. I don't want to
constantly jump back and forth between the two points in the series' 7
year story arc. Nor do I want to have to constantly delete shows
that were recorded from the "other" point in the 7 year cycle.

Sage groups shows into folders that share the same title (i.e. I have
about 40 episodes of Seinfeld and all are in the same folder). When
you are done watching for the day, you can delete the whole folder at
once.

OK, but I don't see how that's relevent.

To your notion about Myth does X and Sage doesn't, that is probably
true.

Well, in this case, I've so far been unable to figure out how to get
Sage to to X.

There are things that they do differently. A couple of years
ago I switched from Paint Shop Pro to Photoshop for my photo editing.
It was a learning curve and to expect Photoshop to work exactly like
Paint Shop Pro would have been assinine on my part.

I don't expect Sage to work exactly like Myth. If what I wanted was
something exactly like Myth, I'd use Myth (as you advised).

But, I am surprised that Sage seems unable to record a 30-minute show
only when it occurs in a particular 30-minute timeslot. It seems like
a rather basic DVR feature. Hence my question on how to accomplish it
under Sage.

And I should state, that everyone has a certain need. If MythTV
meets your needs and Sage doesn't

Myth doesn't meet one important need: the availability of a low-cost,
small, silent, low-power, frontend like the HD200.

it isn't a big deal and stick to what you have. However, if MythTV no
longer meets your needs,

I've never been satisfied with any of the front-end options available
for Myth. When I saw the HD200, I decided that would make it worth
switching to Sage.

then please give Sage a real try and have an open mind about how all
software has their own "way of doing things"

That's what I'm trying to figure out: What is Sage's way of recording
a 30-minute show only when it occurs in a specific timeslot (e.g.
11:00-11:30) and not when it occurs in a different timeslot (e.g.
11:30-12:00).

[Grant.Edwards]

Originally Posted by Yalbik

Let me see if I have the situation correct:
You want to add a favorite for a 30 minute show, which airs at 11:00
and 11:30

Yes

You only want the 11:00 recording

Yes

You've tried to use the favorite -> Advanced Options -> Limit to hour,
but that only specifies down to the hour, not the half-hour....

Exactly.

Two options I can think of:

1) Are the two shows on the same channel? If not, you could limit the
favorite to a specific channel...

Yes, they're on the same channel

OR if they are on the same channel

2) Try setting the "Stop Padding" on the favorite to -30 minutes (i.e.
30 minutes EARLY). to get the 11:00 show, or the start padding to +30
minutes (i.e. 30 minutes later) to get the 11:30 show. I'm not sure
if that will work, but I can't see why not....

I'll give it a try, but don't the same settings apply to both the
11:00 recording and the 11:30 recording? If I set start padding to
+30, how will that not start both recordings 30 minutes late --
resulting in two zero-length recordings?

[Opus4]

As the SageTV PDF manual & UI state, the Favorite setting is "Limit to Hour", thus it is limited to 1-hour time periods.

- Andy

[planetc]

if the EPG data is correct then how about looking for the difference and basing the favorite setting upon that using a keyword?

For example, I have a favorite set for Deadliest Catch but have the season number set as a keyword so I only get the latest season and not the older ones my wife watched before she learnt to use Sage.

[Grant.Edwards]

OK, so a favorite can't be set up to do what I want.

Based on what I've read, it appears that a timed recording will not
have the title, episode, and other program details associated with it.
So that's not a very good option.

How about a way to automate the deletion of unwanted recordings?

Maybe something that uses the scripting framework?

[Grant.Edwards]

Originally Posted by planetc

if the EPG data is correct then how about looking for the difference
and basing the favorite setting upon that using a keyword?

The EPG is correct, and the only difference between the episode I want
and the episode I don't want is the airtime, and differentiating on
that has already been ruled out. :/

For example, I have a favorite set for Deadliest Catch but have the
season number set as a keyword so I only get the latest season and not
the older ones my wife watched before she learnt to use Sage.

The only difference is the airtime. When episode "foo" is aired at
11:00, I want it recorded. When episode "foo" is aired at 11:30, I
don't want it recorded.

[GKusnick]

I ran up against a similar situation a few years back, with episodes from different seasons airing in different timeslots. My solution was to go ahead and record both episodes, watch the ones from earlier in the series in sequence, and let the later ones accumulate until I reached that point in the series. If your sample schedule above is accurate, you'll reach that point in about 16 weeks. Then you'll be able to watch the accumulated episodes at your own pace without having to wait a day (or weekend) in between. Sorting the episode list by original air date makes it fairly painless to keep track of where you are.

If that's not acceptable for whatever reason, and you really need to suppress recording of the later episodes, then your best bet may to set up a scheduled task that uses the scripting framework to preemptively mark those episodes Watched before they're recorded. That will prevent Sage from recording them. 16 weeks from now, when you reach that point in the series and want them recorded after all, you'll have to go back and clear all those Watched flags.

But again, disk space is cheap, and 80 episodes of a half-hour show add up to maybe 100-200 GB. If you can afford to tie up that much space for 16 weeks, I don't see the harm in letting them record now if you intend to watch them eventually anyway.

[matt91]

Originally Posted by GKusnick

But again, disk space is cheap, and 80 episodes of a half-hour show add up to maybe 100-200 GB. If you can afford to tie up that much space for 16 weeks, I don't see the harm in letting them record now if you intend to watch them eventually anyway.

Realizing that it's not addressing your question, but this is how I do it too. I just record everything, and let sage sort by original air date. I do have to remember where I left off, but somehow I manage.

[Yalbik]

Originally Posted by Grant.Edwards

Yes

Yes

Exactly.

Yes, they're on the same channel

I'll give it a try, but don't the same settings apply to both the
11:00 recording and the 11:30 recording? If I set start padding to
+30, how will that not start both recordings 30 minutes late --
resulting in two zero-length recordings?

Damnit...that's what I get for posting before coffee. I meant adjust both start and end padding + or - 30 minutes, but in any case, it's a bad idea...

I'm guessing what sage will do is schedule 2 recordings, both 30 minutes late. In which case you'll end up with the 11:30 show, and whatever's on at 12:00.

Not it is possible that sage first applies the +/- padding, then filters based on hour, but I would bet not.

The bad idea part is that even if it works, Sage will attach the wrong show data for the show....

Weird, what a strange limitation for a perfectly reasonable request....It'd be nice if the gui had a "limit to time" that actually looked at the EPG like it does for "limit to channel"....

[Grant.Edwards]

Originally Posted by Yalbik

I'm guessing what sage will do is schedule 2 recordings, both 30
minutes late.

Based on what I saw in the upcoming recording list (two separate
30-minute recordings), I'm pretty sure that's what would happen.

[...]
The bad idea part is that even if it works, Sage will attach the wrong
show data for the show....

That would be an issue especially if you start marking episodes
"watched" or "didn't like".

Weird, what a strange limitation for a perfectly reasonable
request...

Thanks. I was beginning to feel like everybody though I'd asked how
to do something completely off-the-wall.

For now I'll just manually delete the ones I don't want. I don't have
tons of disk space at the moment, and letting the "other" episodes
accumulate until I catch up to them would end up causing a lot of
other stuff to get auto-deleted before it got watched.

I'll have a look at the scripting API to see if I can delete the
unwanted recordings in a cron job.

[Fuzzy]

It is odd that the limitation is hourly, that said, I agree with Greg's recommendation of just letting it record both. It's really not that much space.