HD-PVR: problems in SageTV with recording reliability, and viewing quality

[segue]

I'm a long-time SageTV user who has just changed over to using the HD-PVR capture device. My installation appears to be good; I followed the advice here:

http://forums.sagetv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44511

I'm using the latest Hauppauge drivers: ver.1.5.6.1, have HD-PVR IR channel changing working for my TimeWarner-furnished ScientificAtlanta 3250HD stb, and have Arcsoft Total Media Extreme (TME) software working OK, too. These latest drivers are necessary for the Arcsoft TME to work (as confirmed to me by Hauppauge tech support). Since the TME capture program allows user-specified, encoded bit rate settings (e.g., I have been using 12mb), and viewing recorded files in the TME player looks much better than in SageTV with my current settings, I have been reluctant to remove the TME program altogether.

My problems are:

(1) SageTV is not recording reliably. Sometimes, it will stop recording after having worked OK for the previous, say, 60 or 90 minutes, at which time recording will fail, giving the report that device is not available, with error message.

(2) When I'm viewing programs in SageTV, the image quality of both Live TV and of recorded .TS files is not nearly as good as in either the TME Capture/View program, or in the TME "Play Video" program (among others). In SageTV, I have both the the default quality and device quality set at "Best-H264"; and have video settings of: Video Renderer: EVR; Mpeg2 Video Decoder Filter: SageTV Mpeg; Mpeg4 Playback: DirectShow; H.264 Video Decoder Filter: ArcSoft Video Decoder.

I would be grateful for help as to the specific settings or other corrections I need to implement in order to obtain: (1) reliable, high quality recording, and (2) maximum viewing quality in SageTV.

Side note: While my 3250HD stb does indeed *output* different channels/programs at various resolutions (e.g., National GeographicHD channel has some programs in 1920x1080, yet others at 1280x1720; yet various non-HD ordinary movie channels are only 720x480, I have not been able to *set* the output resolution in my stb *myself.* (My 3250HD stb output resolutions are: 480i, 480p, 720p, 1080i. While my living room 3250HD stb box [same model unit] accepts and maintains the setting of "1080i," my computer/HD-PVR-connected 3250HD stb box, while offering the above-mentioned four resolutions as Setup options, nevertheless refuses to *accept* a *setting* of 1080i (or for that matter, of 480p, or 720p either).

In the stb's Setup, all four resolution options remain "bulleted," even though I have attempted to make a change to some other resolution setting than 480i, have confirmed that my "tv" (i.e., computer monitor) can support each of these other resolutions, etc. Is this difference in my ability/inability to adjust output resolution settings in the case of these two respective 3250HD stb's somehow connected to the presence of my HD-PVR in the case of one of these boxes, or is it instead, in the case of this same computer/HD-PVR-connected stb, that I possibly have either older firmware, or simply a defective box?

[eric3a]

For issue 1) I only got rid of the "stopped responding" errors after downgrading to HDPVR 1.0.5.301_whql drivers.

Eric

[Rico66]

You can configure bitrates in Sage. Add something like this into sage.properties (shutdown the server, and insert at the alphabetically correct position):

mmc/python2_encoding/HDPVRMax-CBR=videobitrate\=13500000|vbr\=0|outputstreamtype\=1
mmc/python2_encoding/HDPVRMax-VBR=videobitrate\=13500000|vbr\=1|outputstreamtype\=1

These new bitrates (which are the maximum possible, one CBR one VBR) show up the next time you start Sage and can be selected in the UI.

Also, the issue regarding the output resolution is very likely caused by your STB.

[davephan]

There are many things you can do to improve the HD-PVR stability, which shouldn't be necessary if the product was designed properly, but the extra steps are necessary for the HD-PVR.

Use the older 1.0.5.301 driver. Do not use the Hauppauge IR. Cover up the HD-PVR IR lens. Use the USB-UIRT for IR control.

Use a short USB cable without a USB hub. Use an add-on USB card that only controls the HD-PVR. Here's the card I used:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16815104216

Decrease the heat in the HD-PVR by removing the cover. You can also go through the fan modification:

http://blog.arogan.com/2008/06/haupp...odel-1212.html

I have not done the fan modification yet, but plan to do that soon. My HD-PVR had one failure in a month's time. I used to have failures every week. I bought a fan and the black plastic mesh for 39 cents from Michaels to do the fan modification, but haven't done it yet.

You can also use SageAlert to automatically detect the HD-PVR error, then trigger Growler. Growler can then be used to trigger a power resetting device to automatically reset the HD-PVR power.

I ordered a power controlling device, which is supposed to work with IR controls:

http://www.dealextreme.com/search.dx/search.13147

I'll do both the fan modification and automatic power reset to improve the stability. I haven't been in a big hurry to do them yet, so I can determine how often the HD-PVR fails with the current modifications. The failure rate is very low now compared to before.

A product should require this much extra effort, but the HD-PVR does. There aren't a lot of choices for recording HD content without a HD-PVR. However, the HD-PVR stability and reliability can be improved if you go through many extra steps.

Dave

[sic0048]

So you are playing back the files using a computer? Unfortunately, that adds a lot more variables to consider. Obviously the image quality of the recorded files is fine. However, you are getting varying degrees of playback quality depending on which method you use to play it back. That usually means a codec issue. I really don't have any advice to give because I use a hardware extender for all my playback. So I've never had to set up playback of HD-PVR files on a computer.

Good luck. I'm sure with the support of the community you can figure it out.

[sic0048]

Originally Posted by davephan

There are many things you can do to improve the HD-PVR stability, which shouldn't be necessary if the product was designed properly, but the extra steps are necessary for the HD-PVR.

....Do not use the Hauppauge IR. .... Use the USB-UIRT for IR control.

Dave

Not to belabor the point, but I really don't think this is a valid argument. I'm not saying the Hauppauge IR blaster is easy to set up, but I've not see anything that points to it being the cause of instability. It's a red herring and causes confusion IMHO.

I realize that there are some people that cannot get the IR Blaster set up initially for some unknown reason. For those people I can understand recommending moving to the USB-UIRT. But those people who get the Hauppauge Blaster up and running properly don't seem to have more or less stability problems than those that use a third party blaster.

Covering up the IR receiver on the HD-PVR does seem to help with stability and I would recommend doing that for everyone. But that is not related to using the IR Blaster. If people are using the HD-PVR with Sage, they do not need the IR receiver - Sage handles all communication with the unit through the USB port.

[Skirge01]

Originally Posted by sic0048

Not to belabor the point, but I really don't think this is a valid argument. I'm not saying the Hauppauge IR blaster is easy to set up, but I've not see anything that points to it being the cause of instability. It's a red herring and causes confusion IMHO.

I'll just add what my experience was. I had no intentions of using the Hauppauge IR blaster, so I bought a USB-UIRT and used that from day 1. What I found and proved is that the Hauppauge IR was receiving signals from my Harmony 880 when it shouldn't have been and those signals were causing the HD-PVR to hiccup (momentarily stop recording and start again). I could reproduce this on demand and covering the IR blaster fixed it. While this didn't cause "instability" of the HD-PVR per se, it was definitely an issue.

[sic0048]

Originally Posted by Skirge01

I'll just add what my experience was. I had no intentions of using the Hauppauge IR blaster, so I bought a USB-UIRT and used that from day 1. What I found and proved is that the Hauppauge IR was receiving signals from my Harmony 880 when it shouldn't have been and those signals were causing the HD-PVR to hiccup (momentarily stop recording and start again). I could reproduce this on demand and covering the IR blaster fixed it. While this didn't cause "instability" of the HD-PVR per se, it was definitely an issue.

But that issue revolved around the Hauppauge IR Receiver, not the Hauppauge IR Blaster. They really are two different systems designed for two different purposes. Nobody using SageTV should be using the Hauppauge IR Receiver -hence the advice to cover it up.

I just think there has been a long standing assumption with people that the Hauppauge IR blaster is partially to blame with instability issues. Therefore many people make blanket recommendation to buy the USB-UIRT when in reality it has no effect on the stability of the system. I'm just trying to save people $50 by making sure everyone understands that the Hauppauge IR Blaster (if successfully setup) has no effect on the overall stability of the system.

Actually your story is a perfect example of this. You bought the USB-UIRT and yet still had stability issues with the HD-PVR. While you might have bought the USB-UIRT to control more than 1 STB, you could have also bought it because of incorrect advice on these forums that the built in blaster is a source of instability. If you did so because of the 2nd reason, you effectively wasted $50 of your money. (Edit - actually from your signature it seems that you have more than 1 HD-PVR which is a perfectly valid reason to buy a USB-UIRT - but hopefully you understand the point I was trying to make).

I just want people to stop spreading a false assumption that the Hauppauge IR Blaster is crap, shouldn't be used, and causes instability issue. I'll be the first to admit that the built in blaster is a pain to work with and some people cannot seem to get it installed and set up correctly (and seemingly not due to any user errors). But when it is set up correctly, it works fine and does not cause instability issues.

[joe123]

Originally Posted by sic0048

I just think there has been a long standing assumption with people that the Hauppuage IR blaster is partially to blame with instability issues. Therefore many people make blanket recommendation to buy the USB-UIRT when in reality it has no effect on the stability of the system. I'm just trying to save people $50 by making sure everyone understands that the Hauppauge IR Blaster (if successfully setup) has no effect on the overall stability of the system.

I have been using the HD-PVR IR blaster since day 1 with 100% success.

I also experienced many months of headaches with the HD-PVR red ico stops producing data errors and HD-PVR recordings skips.

I tried everything listed here with little success to no sucess.

I finnaly upgraded my PVR to the specs on my signature and ALL OF MY HD-PVR PROBLEMS HAVE GONE AWAY.

My HD-PVR is now rock solid and it records without any skips, red icons, or any type of problem.

I do agree with others that you will probably get much better viewing experince with something like a HD200 extender.