Purchasing cheap PC's?

[rwc]

I'm not looking for an endorsement (or advertisement) here, but I'm curious where people find their 'cheap' computer systems?

I LOVE newegg, but i was surprised to find i could buy a "desktop" computer from bestbuy and add some more memory and hard drives for less money than building it myself.

What do other people do? Ebay?

rwc

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by rwc

I LOVE newegg, but i was surprised to find i could buy a "desktop" computer from bestbuy and add some more memory and hard drives for less money than building it myself.

You can, but the reason they're cheaper is because the components aren't as good, and you've got less upgrade options.

Personaly ebay is the last place I buy things.

[doc]

If a friend wants a PC for general internet use then I point them to an online shop that does some cheap good cheap deals, plus they get the warranty so I don't have to worry about it.

As for myself & family I still build systems. It may cost a little more but in the end you get what you pay for. I like to make sure the motherboards have enough connectors, slots & connections for what I'm going to need, and the other parts fit my requirements - specific hard drives/graphics cards/psu etc. If you buy a pre-made box you never know what's going to be inside it.

As for ebay, I've never bought a thing, but that might be down to paranoia!

[PiX64]

Agreed - I rarely buy from ebay...

I have always had good luck with Fry's, tigerdirect, and newegg. IMHO if you build your own you know the components will be quality because you are picking them out, not just buying whatever crap the prebuilt systems have in them.

[reggie14]

Originally Posted by stanger89

You can, but the reason they're cheaper is because the components aren't as good, and you've got less upgrade options.

This is partially true, but I'm not sure to what extent I believe the components are that much worse, depending on what you mean by that. I'm not entirely convinced that, for instance, Dell uses components that are less reliable than those typically selected by self-builders on Newegg. The feature set tends to be more limited, which may or may not be a problem, depending on what you're looking for.

I've always order components off Newegg and and done self-builds. That's mainly for two reasons: 1) I want more expandability than what Dell/HP/etc. have offered, and 2) I almost always intend to shuffle parts around between systems I currently have and reuse some in the new box. Because of item 2, I'm usually not losing that much money by building it myself. Since I always just have two desktops at any given time, I just keep reusing the OS licenses I purchased years ago, which also saves money.

I think there are some other advantages to pre-built systems. First, with some exceptions, they typically come at least moderately quiet. And two, at least in my experience, they pretty much always come in working condition, whereas I've had to RMA individual components when I've self-built (which is really annoying if it is something like a motherboard!).

[heatvent]

I tend to buy from Dell outlet when they are clearing out inventory and have a coupon code. Building your own gets killed by the cost of the OS.

About a year ago, I got a 531s w/ 2.1ghz AMD X2 dual core, Vista premium, 320gb hd, 1gb of memory, and wifi for $161 + tax w/ free shipping. Vista alone would cost more than half of that at the time. To build something similar would have cost easily $300+. Now this is a slim case but a nice PC for websurfing, etc. and in a quiet nicely built case.

[Skirge01]

Originally Posted by reggie14

I'm not entirely convinced that, for instance, Dell uses components that are less reliable than those typically selected by self-builders on Newegg.

Preface: I work for a large, multi-million dollar corporation anyone from the US has, at the very least, heard of. We buy Dells because we get great discounts on our large purchases. Just like every other company, we also buy about the least expensive models we can get away with (GX280's, for instance).

In my experience, just like anywhere else, you get what you pay for. If you buy the cheaper computers, that's what you're getting. Don't be surprised when they fail, as I have watched just about all of ours do multiple times over the few years we use them.

That said, if you buy from Dell's upper-end, XPS line, you are also getting what you pay for; that being a well-built machine from quality parts. Obviously, YMMV, but this has been my experience for the past 15 years.

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by reggie14

This is partially true, but I'm not sure to what extent I believe the components are that much worse, depending on what you mean by that. I'm not entirely convinced that, for instance, Dell uses components that are less reliable than those typically selected by self-builders on Newegg. The feature set tends to be more limited, which may or may not be a problem, depending on what you're looking for.

Yeah, that's really what I'm getting at. If you get a Dell, especially the "cheap" ones, then you've got no expandability (my work Dell, they got me a new video card when I got approved to get a second monitor, and it had 0 extra power connections on the PSU), the BIOs is crippled, the drivers are hard to find. Limited slots, proprietary power supplies, etc, etc.

Now if you go with the cheap "off brand" type stuff, well you're taking your fate in your own hands with being able to get support/drivers at any point in the future.

I think there are some other advantages to pre-built systems. First, with some exceptions, they typically come at least moderately quiet. And two, at least in my experience, they pretty much always come in working condition, whereas I've had to RMA individual components when I've self-built (which is really annoying if it is something like a motherboard!).

Yeah, if I were recommending to someone else, who wasn't a geek, I'd recommend going with like a Dell or something (but not the off brand worst-buy stuff). But I guess my big point is that a $300 PC is $300 for a reason, and it's not so much because the builder gets a great deal on parts. What I've seen to find is that if you start going for "like" components, eg if you go to Dell and start configuring a PC like you'd build, you end up with something very close in cost to doing it yourself.

Here's an example, I've been looking at upgrading my desktop to a Core i7, Dell's got the very nice looking Studio XPS 435, when I configure it with 12GB of memory, and everything else about default (Core i7 920, 12GB ram, 500GB HDD, Vista Ultimate, DVD drive, 3650), I end up with a machine that's $1600.

On newegg I can throw together something better:
Antec P182 case
12GB Corsair XMS
Core i7 920
ASUS X58 Mobo
Gigabyte 9600
80GB Intel X25-M SSD
Vista Ultimate 64
Lite-on DVD burner
All for about $30 more than the Dell, and that's with a >$300 SSD in the mix.

[reggie14]

Originally Posted by stanger89

On newegg I can throw together something better:

True. Self building starts making more sense at higher price points. I find it's tougher to build comparable machines for less than $1000, particularly if you wait until Dell or Micro Center has a good sale going on.

Though, I'm curious, what are you doing that you envision 12 gigs of RAM will be useful?

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by reggie14

True. Self building starts making more sense at higher price points. I find it's tougher to build comparable machines for less than $1000, particularly if you wait until Dell or Micro Center has a good sale going on.

But that's kind of the point, to get under $1000, especially down into the ~$300 range that you can find from Dell and the like, you really start giving sacrificing the quality/features of the parts. Note I didn't necessarily say less reliable.

Though, I'm curious, what are you doing that you envision 12 gigs of RAM will be useful?

Who knows. I've got 1GB in my Desktop and it's not enough, going to an i7, 3GB is really where it starts (since you want the 3 channel memory) but then I was figuring 6GB for future proofing, and then the other day I really looked at prices and 12GB is only $200, so it's more a case of "why not".

[GKusnick]

The other point about low-end prebuilt PCs is that they're not engineered for expandability or upgradability. The expectation is that you'll never open the box and will simply replace the whole machine with a newer model in a couple of years. So they may work reasonably well as they come from the manufacturer, but as soon as you start adding in extra drives, tuners, graphics cards, etc. you run the risk of inadequate power, airflow & cooling issues, IRQ conflicts, and so on.

Plus those cheap stamped sheetmetal cases never have enough room and are pretty much guaranteed to slice your knuckles when you try to work on them.

[bastafidli]

I built our main desktop PC for $350 using parts from Frys not including monitor. It is C2D with 4GB RAM, microATX motherboard with about 2TB of storage (already had 500GB HDD) and 2 NVidia GForce2 (old) videocards since we are using it as multiseat. with This doesn't include OS since I had already a license and it now runs Linux anyway. It has been running for over 2 years without any issues.

[Djc208]

That is one of the other advantages of building your own. I'll upgrade a component here and another there, then do a more significant rebuild and repeat. Throughout these upgrades I end up with enough spare parts to cobble another PC together which usually ends up somewhere for light duty.

My latest one is in the garage for looking up parts, pictures, records, and some audio playback.

Actually that's how I started my Sage PC. Ironically I bought my last MB because while a great MB for my desktop I knew it would eventually make a perfect MB for my Sage server

[Tokendude]

Two places I used to buy custom designed pc's assembled by a supplier are:

http://www.directron.com

and

http://www.gcworkshop.com

Both give excellent customer service. Directron has great buys on more "budget" type pc's. For instance, I just yesterday ordered a 2.5GHz dual core (not Core2 Duo), 2gig ram(DDR2-667), 250gig HD, DVD writer, decent mid-tower case, 500watt ps, Radeon 4350/512mb all for $325 delivered (no o/s).

This will be my 17yo daughter's machine, and she does normal teenager stuff.

At the same time I was toying with configuring a pretty strong pc from GCW and it was less than $1000 for pretty much a top of the line system )excluding video cards), including 4 gigs ram (DDR2-1066), 1TB secondary storage, 250gig main drive, top line Gigabyte MB (I swear by these). Extra case cooling for HD's, etc.

I've ordered several machines from both companies and have never had a complaint. I like that I can pick and chose from the components to get exactly what I want...

Roy

[sic0048]

What makes the OEM machines from Dell, etc so attractive is the OS. You can generally build comparable machines for about the same amount of money SANS the OS. So generally a home build is going to run $100-$150 more.

That being said, the ability to choose every part for a computer is very nice. Far too often the OEM machines don't have exactly what I need. Especially when it comes to expansion slots now adays. It seems like the OEMs are build with a very limited number of expansion slots now.

Buying a $399 OEM machine might be great until you want to add that extra device and find out that it won't fit because there are not enough of the correct slots.

Just my 2 cents.

[reggie14]

I kind of wonder how much expandability is going to be a factor in the near future. Generally speaking, expandability has referred to the number of free PCI/PCI-e slots and the number of hard drives you could hook up. But, the number of free PCI slots has essentially become a non-issue. Pretty much all the stuff everyone needs in on the motherboard anyway. For us, it used to be nice to have lots of PCI slots for TV tuners, but as we move to HD things like the HDHR and HD-PVR seem to be the best options, and they don't take up any.

Hard drives is an important issue. I, for one, do have all my storage hard drives on my Sage server. But, I think many are looking at using NAS/WHS boxes, and I think that's going to get more and more common for people with large storage needs. I've been thinking about either buying a MediaSmart WHS, or taking my old 2.4Ghz Athlon XP box and turning into one.