Why I don't like the default STV Part #1: The Main Menu

[bcjenkins]

Originally Posted by Taddeusz

Considering other extenders with similar or the same hardware have interfaces with more pizazze SageTV I really don't think that is necessarily the limitation.

Mind sharing? Everything I have seen for other PVR solutions have not had the same capabilities. Then again, haven't looked in a while. Keep in mind the UI needs to be rendered on the host, not the extender.

B

[Brent]

I have a tiny bit of insight into the UI thing due to a discussion I recently had. Based on that, I would say that a serious consideration when changing the UI needs to be made for lower-end processors - and that definitely includes the HD100 and HD200 extenders.

You know those moving background images you see on the Vista (and W7) Media Center computers? Notice you can get those animations on the XBox 360, but not successfully on the other 3rd party extenders? That's because the XBox 360 has more power (along with more noise & electric bill). Extenders in general use a lower powered CPU (take a look at the specs and compare to a PC) and that translates into a need to not use up valuable CPU on animations that don't really add much to the use of the device.

Now with that out of the way, I totally agree that some changes can be made to the default UI to spruce things up and make it better. Get enough visual appeal that it pleases as many people as possible, but allow for the basic flexibility to easlily change the UI for those that want something a little different. Now the hard part is explaining exactly what that means and would look like - that's the hard part really.

[sainswor99]

I guess that since we're opening up this discussion again, I may as well jump in with my thoughts as well. For me, it's not so much the lack of visual pizazz as it is a) the inconsistencies in the interface, and b) the "too-many-clicks" issue.

For the inconsistencies, take a look at the Detailed Setup...Multimedia Choices...

1. Try changing your Aspect Ratio Mode. The Close button is at the top of the list.

2. Modify your Aspect Ratio Settings. The Close button is at the bottom.

3. Overscan settings? Use Done instead of Close.

4. Recording Quality? The Close button is back, at the bottom. Video Menu Options are the same.

5. UI Language? Screw the close button, just pick an option, and the window closes for you.


As far as the too-many-clicks, others have complained about what you do to delete a video (and I know there are customizations to address this), but I'm thinking that overall, it's complicated to actually do something. Watching LiveTV and Recorded TV is fairly easy, but listening to music is a challenge. Again, I think it's because of the question of whether or not SageTV is a media center or a TV app that has some media center functions.

[tmiranda]

My dream is that the "Phoenix Project" will be the new, supported, official, blingy, Sage UI.

[Fuzzy]

I'm in no waying saying that the flashiness is pointless, I'm just saying that the complaints need to be more clear. The navigation aspect of the default STV is actually quite good, it's the UI APPEARANCE that people want updated. This is why the arguments to just clone VMC/7MC (which would be a step backwards, navigation wise) is not really an accurate way to describe what most people want.

[cncb]

Originally Posted by Brent

You know those moving background images you see on the Vista (and W7) Media Center computers? Notice you can get those animations on the XBox 360, but not successfully on the other 3rd party extenders? That's because the XBox 360 has more power (along with more noise & electric bill). Extenders in general use a lower powered CPU (take a look at the specs and compare to a PC) and that translates into a need to not use up valuable CPU on animations that don't really add much to the use of the device.

This along with all the waiting for them to add support for things (Hulu, Netflix, internet radio, etc.) to the extender has me really considering going back to using a PC. I could be using Hulu Desktop and the VMC Netflix integrated plugin for example if I were currently using a PC. I remember what a pain it was sometimes when using a PC connected to the tv but I guess I'm tired of waiting (not to mention all the lockups with the HD200 with the recent Betas). You don't have something to share with us from your interview that could bring me back from the ledge, do you ?

[reggie14]

Originally Posted by tmiranda

My dream is that the "Phoenix Project" will be the new, supported, official, blingy, Sage UI.

Actually, the secretive nature of who is working on Phoenix is making me think Narflex might be one of the developers. I'm guessing he's at least helping the Phoenix developers get things working in Sage. So, this might not be that crazy of a dream.

[MeInMaui]

Originally Posted by reggie14

Actually, the secretive nature of who is working on Phoenix is making me think Narflex might be one of the developers. I'm guessing he's at least helping the Phoenix developers get things working in Sage. So, this might not be that crazy of a dream.

Lets squash this rumor right away. There is no official involvement from SageTV on Project Phoenix. I haven't disclosed the members of the team because I haven't asked their permission to do so.

So in short, Phoenix won't be supported (by SageTV) or official, but in my slightly biased opinion it will be insanely awesome.

Aloha,
Mike

[bcjenkins]

C'mon Mike, why did you have to do that. We could have had weeks of speculation first!

[MeInMaui]

Originally Posted by bcjenkins

C'mon Mike, why did you have to do that. We could have had weeks of speculation first!

Sorry 'bout that. I have 3 small kids at home, so I've gotten pretty good at heading off potential disasters before they pose a danger.

Aloha,
Mike

[reggie14]

Originally Posted by MeInMaui

Sorry 'bout that. I have 3 small kids at home, so I've gotten pretty good at heading off potential disasters before they pose a danger.

That also means you're prepared for the inevitable "Is it done yet?... Is it done yet?... IS IT DONE YET?"

[MeInMaui]

Originally Posted by reggie14

That also means you're prepared for the inevitable "Is it done yet?... Is it done yet?... IS IT DONE YET?"

Ah, but all of the parenting books say you are supposed to ignore that kind of behavior.

Aloha,
Mike

[Skirge01]

I just want to know if Nikolaus thinks Phoenix exists or not. We know he'll tell us the truth.

[toricred]

Nikolaus is probably the mastermind behind the whole thing. He's clearly smarter than any of us.

[PLUCKYHD]

Originally Posted by Brent

You know those moving background images you see on the Vista (and W7) Media Center computers? Notice you can get those animations on the XBox 360, but not successfully on the other 3rd party extenders?

That is not entirely true. While it was in the past I was able with the latest updates to get the animations on vista with a linksys 2100 extender. Originally before sp2 I had issues. It wasn't as smooth as the xbox but I did get animations

Plus is it my understaning the UI for hd200/hd100 are done at the pc not the extender. Hence my joker theme runs sometimes smoother on my hd200 then my client pc.

cheers

[evilpenguin]

Originally Posted by bcjenkins

C'mon Mike, why did you have to do that. We could have had weeks of speculation first!

Agreed. You know, I heard that the Phoenix project was a joint venture between Sage, Hulu, and Santa Clause.

[Brent]

Originally Posted by cncb

(not to mention all the lockups with the HD200 with the recent Betas).

What lockups are you having? My HD200s have been running perfectly with the latest beta/firmware.

Originally Posted by PLUCKYHD

That is not entirely true. While it was in the past I was able with the latest updates to get the animations on vista with a linksys 2100 extender. Originally before sp2 I had issues. It wasn't as smooth as the xbox but I did get animations

Plus is it my understaning the UI for hd200/hd100 are done at the pc not the extender.

Yes much of the UI is done at the PC, but the way I understand it some of the animations require CPU use on the playback machine (extender or client PC) itself hence the requirement to make sure the UI doesn't needlessly use up too much CPU

Hence my joker theme runs sometimes smoother on my hd200 then my client pc.

Joker theme? Did I miss that one?

[Brent]

Originally Posted by evilpenguin

Agreed. You know, I heard that the Phoenix project was a joint venture between Sage, Hulu, and Santa Clause.

I've been getting unverified reports that homeland security is somehow involved as well, but everytime I mention project phoenix to a government agency they deny any knowledge. Just strange

[PLUCKYHD]

Originally Posted by Brent

Joker theme? Did I miss that one?

I don't know how you could

HomePage Joker

Came out with the official release friday

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by PLUCKYHD

Plus is it my understaning the UI for hd200/hd100 are done at the pc not the extender. Hence my joker theme runs sometimes smoother on my hd200 then my client pc.

The logic is executed on the server, but the graphics are rendered on the extenders. I like to think of it like Xwindows, the GUI is drawn on the remote PC, but when you execute some processing, it occurs on the server/host.

Vs MCE extenders which I believe work basically by RDP.