min hardware box on TV

[rak306]

I do not yet have Sage TV but expect to soon. I've reviewed the archives, but I am confused.

I want to set up a set top box with no monitor, connected only via S-video out to my TV and 100 ethernet to my main computer with a capture board(PVR 250). My requirements are:

1) High quality video. You should see virtually no difference between input (digital cable or satallite) and output. (3GBH/hr?)

2) Small box with minimal fan noise.

3) Once set up, needs to be controllable from remote only, on tv screen. (I will use vnc from the other computer).

4) low cost.


I was hoping a mini-ITX card with its built in mpeg decoder could do it, but from some of the posts, it does not appear up to the task of both ethernet traffic and MPEG-2 decoding. This should be able to be put together for under $300.

At the other extreme, a 2.4 GHz Celestron with 128 meg, and a PVR 350, should clearly be up to the task. The computer is available from Dell for under $400, and the PVR350 for $200.

The mini-ITX would be small and quiet, the Dell wouldn't.

By the way both Pinnacle showtime and Linksys wireless media adapter have the hardware to be up to the task, and are low cost, but likely would not work with Sage TV (?)

Please comment on what I want to do. (I'm sure there are others in the same boat.)

Rick

[stanger89]

I'd say get a mini-itx and put a 350 in that, you can always put all your storage in the
main computer, that should get you what you want.

The Pinnacle/Linksys things should be able to view the files Sage records, but you won't be able to use any of Sage's features from the living room (set watched, schedule recordings, LiveTV, etc).

[fidget]

I would recommend a minimum of 512 MB of RAM. I have a mini-ITX computer driving my TV via a PVR-350 and I periodically have the UI freeze while Windows is paging to/from disk. I am running WindowsXP with 224 MB of RAM (256 MB with 32 dedicated to the built in video).

When I have the OSD visible, my CPU usage jumps from 1-2% to 25-30%. My CPU is a 1 GHz VIA C3. I think a fanless 600 MHz would work just fine. The fan on the 1 GHz version is rather annoying (it is louder than the power supplly fan).

[phenixdragon]

Personally I think the 350 card is a waste to spend money on. I use to use it myself with the video out, but I receive the same quality from my onboard ATI video and I also see when something crashes where as with the 350 you would just see it lock up when it may not be just locked up.

Here is what I suggest on going with.
Mobo: P4R800-VM ($82)
CPU: A Celeron of your choice
Case: SimpleMax 101 ($50)
RAM: 256 is good but with the mobo you need a name brand. It is pretty picky. ($30-$50?)
Remote: X10 RF

Now the video out on the board I believe does hardware decoding. I never actually looked into if it actually does but regardless it works better then the 350 out since I can see Windows.

[fidget]

Originally posted by phenixdragon
Personally I think the 350 card is a waste to spend money on. I use to use it myself with the video out, but I receive the same quality from my onboard ATI video and I also see when something crashes where as with the 350 you would just see it lock up when it may not be just locked up.

Here is what I suggest on going with.
Mobo: P4R800-VM ($820
CPU: A Celeron of your choice
Case: SimpleMax 101 ($50)
RAM: 256 is good but with the mobo you need a name brand. It is pretty picky. ($30-$50?)
Remote: X10 RF

Now the video out on the board I believe does hardware decoding. I never actually looked into if it actually does but regardless it works better then the 350 out since I can see Windows.

Personally, I have yet to see a software MPEG decoder that comes close to the sharpness of the PVR-350's output. To me, they all have a soft look to them (i.e., slightly blurry), which I can't stand. The output of the PVR-350 is on par with the output of my DVD player.

[phenixdragon]

All debatable since we are detailing with different setup and that are always difference; but also now they are coming with hardware decoding.

[phenixdragon]

I just checked and this mobo has MPEG-2 hardware decoding. I thought I saw that before was wasn't sure. So you can't go wrong with it for your TV out.

[stanger89]

That would be hardware acceleration not HW Decoding, a small but important difference.

Just to further confuse the issue, the 350 is pointless if you're using an HDTV, so if you think you might be getting an HDTV sometime it's another thing to consider.

[phenixdragon]

That is true. If you are going HDTV the 350 can not help you.

[rak306]

All,

Thanks for your replies. I will not be going HDTV soon, as my 50 in large screen does not support it.

Another dump question. Can the client be set up to be diskless, and boot over the network, or is that beyond the imagination of Mr Gates?

Rick

[fidget]

Originally posted by rak306
All,

Thanks for your replies. I will not be going HDTV soon, as my 50 in large screen does not support it.

Another dump question. Can the client be set up to be diskless, and boot over the network, or is that beyond the imagination of Mr Gates?

Rick

I haven't tried it, but I would believe that it is beyond Mr. Gate's abilities. For me, I put an 80 GB HDD in my STB and have added it to my list of target drives.

[stanger89]

Network boot is quite dificult from what I've read, but you could install a Compact Flash with an IDE/CF adapter.

[phenixdragon]

This is possible through 3rd party software. Also some motherboards also allow you to set your boot order to your NIC; with it set to your NIC you don’t even need to use a HDD.

But what would your reason be to boot off the network? Personally I don’t see a need for home use because putting in a HDD is so cheap and you still need another computer up and running.

[stanger89]

Why?

One less component spinning and making heat/noise.

[phenixdragon]

Hmmm......good point. :P How about a fanless VIA setup. Or just wait for the media MVP.

[rak306]

>Hmmm......good point. :P How about a fanless VIA setup. Or just wait for the >media MVP.
>__________________
>Brian


This is where I started. I want a low cost, small form factor, live/recorded video player at the TV, with minimal acoustic noise. I'll ethernet this to the main computer server. The mini-ITX solution probably can't do it at high quality without a hardware addin card like the pvr350.

Another reason to go diskless (use a ram disk if windows insists on having some disk) would be to eliminate any performance penality based on disk access. For example, fidget said his 1 Ghz mini-ITX froze sometimes with the OSD due to paging to/from disk. How big is a minimal windows runtime, running sage client. I would shurely think it could be done in less than 200 mByte, without ever needing to go to disk.

stranger89's idea of using a ide/compact flash card for booting seems the best. I would think I should be able to boot off the flash card, create a ram disk, copy windows to the ram disk and boot off that. Then windows would not have much of a penality for paging. But I'm sure the is some gotcha there.

Brian,
What is media MVP?

Rick

[phenixdragon]

http://www.hauppauge.com/html/mediamvp_datasheet.htm

Basically it is a system that can read the files over the network. Sage may support it in the future where you will have the same setup like the client. But right now it won't work on it but from what you can read in the forums here it is a pretty safe bet it will be or something like it will be. No HDTV though. But other then that it is the way to go.

[phenixdragon]

Ohh also the ITX board should work fine.

[rak306]

Brian,

Wow! That sure is the right hardware solution (cost/size), but I need the sage client software to work with it! I must have live TV/pause/rewind etc. That's the whole point. I guess I'll have to wait a bit.

Rick

[fidget]

Originally posted by rak306
Brian,

Wow! That sure is the right hardware solution (cost/size), but I need the sage client software to work with it! I must have live TV/pause/rewind etc. That's the whole point. I guess I'll have to wait a bit.

Rick

I believe that it does have these features. What it is missing is the ability to watch live TV (as far as SageTV is concerned) and scheduling (as well as the rest of the SageTV UI).

You won't be able to watch DivX, or any non MPEG format. For me, this is not a problem.