STP-HD200 - Can you use USB wifi adapter

[wayner]

This device has a USB port - would you be able to plug in a USB wifi adapter and have Sage use this for your network connection rather than using the ethernet port?

I am guessing not but I hope that I am wrong.

If it requires special software/firmware is there any chance that Sage would write that, even if it required one to buy a specific Wireless adapter i.e. this would only work with the Linksys WUSB300N?

[Brent]

I think it is possible via the USB2 ports, but would require something to be built into the firmware. Hopefully this is something SageTV can address soon, but for now the answer is no it doesn't currently support wifi.

[CollinR]

Linksys makes a game console adapter that should suffice if you can really keep up the bandwidth.

[dravenone]

You can use the Linksys wireless game adapter.You need a pc to configure it then connect it to a wired ethernet jack like in the back of the extender. The device shouldn't know the difference, it's just an added expense. The model is WGA54G.

[reggie14]

First, I wouldn't expect to see wireless functionality any time soon. I would think Sage would have to do quite a bit of work for each wireless adapter they want to support. This seems like a waste of time when there are already reasonably good options for wireless networking in the form of wireless bridges. I'm using a wireless N bridge from Netgear that works pretty well. I recommend getting something that operates in the 5ghz range.

Second, wireless G is too slow for HD streaming. Its awfully close to being fast enough, but trying to stream HD over a G network is painful.

[wayner]

Sorry - I should have mentioned in my original post that I was assuming that you would need a 802.11n wireless network as g likely isn't fast enough as a full HD stream is 19 mbps and it is rare to sustain that speed on wireless g although it is technically supposed to be 54 mbps.

The problem with the WGA54G is that it is G - you could get a bridge but they tend to be much more expensive than USB adapters.

[wayner]

Originally Posted by reggie14

First, I wouldn't expect to see wireless functionality any time soon. I would think Sage would have to do quite a bit of work for each wireless adapter they want to support. This seems like a waste of time when there are already reasonably good options for wireless networking in the form of wireless bridges.

You could use this same argument to say that no device, except for portable devices like laptops, should bother building in wifi as you can just buy a bridge!

I guess my other option is to go with powerline adapters

[Brent]

Guys, it wouldn't require SageTV much work. It's already being done (Wireless N via USB2) on some very similar devices so the embedded linux drivers are there and should be easy to put into the HD200 firmware. It would limit you to a select couple of WIFI-N usb sticks though. I'll dig up that research I did to see which ones those were - maybe we can help SageTV out with finding the driver files to embed

I agree that G isn't good enough. Has to be N even with its issues. I'm one that prefers the wired route if at all possible, but it would be nice to have the option...

[reggie14]

Originally Posted by wayner

You could use this same argument to say that no device, except for portable devices like laptops, should bother building in wifi as you can just buy a bridge!

Not exactly. I think there are perfectly good reasons for building in wifi. I just think there's limited use for USB wifi adapters. The bridges often aren't any more expensive than USB adapters, and usually can do more (like act like a wireless access point). There seems to be two arguments for supporting them. 1) some devices don't have ethernet ports, and 2) because of the first reason, sometimes you have a USB adapter lying around.

I'd say if you're on a budget, get a WRT150N and load DD-WRT on it. But, personally I'd recommend getting something that would work in the 5ghz range. Budget wireless N equipment generally only have 2.4ghz radios. Netgear has a wireless N bridging kit (WNHDEB111) that has two bridges (one for each endpoint) for $170. Sort of pricey, and sort of limited in functionality. I think it only has 5ghz radios in it, which means you can't connect some wireless N adapters to it.

Brent-
Perhaps its not as much work as I think then. I'm not sure how specialized the drivers need to be for a particular platform, or if the porting process is quite a bit of work. I just assumed the porting process would be somewhat significant. Either way, the Sage application would have to tie into the wifi adapter driver so you can select an AP and enter WEP/WPA keys. A rather trivial task, but still some amount of work.

[Brent]

Originally Posted by Brent

Guys, it wouldn't require SageTV much work. It's already being done (Wireless N via USB2) on some very similar devices so the embedded linux drivers are there and should be easy to put into the HD200 firmware. It would limit you to a select couple of WIFI-N usb sticks though. I'll dig up that research I did to see which ones those were - maybe we can help SageTV out with finding the driver files to embed

I agree that G isn't good enough. Has to be N even with its issues. I'm one that prefers the wired route if at all possible, but it would be nice to have the option...

The USB Wireless N cards that seem to be working with the devices very similar to the HD200 are the atheros-based wifi cards. Open source devs welcome so I would think its a matter of SageTV putting it in the firmware, testing and then announcing it can accept the atheros-based wifi cards.

More on the Atheros Based Wifi & open source via Engadget

[dravenone]

I thought I edited my post but I guess I didn't hit reply. Linksys also makes a N version of the wireless game adapter.

[CollinR]

Originally Posted by dravenone

I thought I edited my post but I guess I didn't hit reply. Linksys also makes a N version of the wireless game adapter.

Yea I know it's not really worth arguing over, I hate wireless but was just tring to be helpful.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16833124279

[Slipshod]

Originally Posted by Brent

I agree that G isn't good enough. Has to be N even with its issues. I'm one that prefers the wired route if at all possible, but it would be nice to have the option...

I'm curious about your issues with 11n. What's still wrong/problematic with it? (I work in the industry, thus the curiosity).

[Brent]

Originally Posted by Slipshod

I'm curious about your issues with 11n. What's still wrong/problematic with it? (I work in the industry, thus the curiosity).

Dang it - I should have known there would be an expert in the midst ... I have to fess up - I've read about issues with 802.11n and do not have any experience with it. I have a modded wrt54g (make that two) that I use in my home. So maybe there aren't the same issues any more??? If my memory serves me right most of the issues were with earlier devices using pre-draft 802.11n stuff that weren't upgradeable - stuff like inconsistent signal strength etc.

[emveepee]

I have the 802.11n USB for the PCH (Sigma SoC based SMP8634) and I do not consider it is capable of reliable HD, it tops out with DVD iso even when I am in the same room as the router. You might get ok performance with an HD PVR file because of the compression, but ATSC/QAM 20 Mbs is a no-go.

The router is indicating 108 Mbs for what that's worth.

Martin

[reggie14]

I use a Netgear wireless-n bridging kit that uses 5ghz radios. I find that it usually works pretty well, but I do get occasional hiccups. I do live in an apartment building around lots of other APs, but as far as I can tell no one is using wifi with 5ghz radios around me (I don't see any other wireless A or N APs around). Its perfectly reliable for SD, but HD definitely isn't perfect. I'm happy with it, mainly because running wires wasn't an option and I wasn't convinced powerline networking was going to be much better, given the old wiring in my apartment building. But, it definitely doesn't look like you'd be able to reliably stream HD if there were a lot of other APs causing interference.

[stevech]

11n issues
it's no faster/better than 11g (except creating new revenue for the vendors, given they saturated the 11g market).
it has an option for supporting two-channel-operation (channel pair bonding), to double the air link speed. BUT, this uses 2/3 of the entire WiFi band. Therefore, most vendors drop back to single channel (11g-like) if there are ANY non-11n SSIDs detected. It *should* do so if any are detected among *all* of the 2/3 of the band channels. This and other issues is why 11n rarely supports and rarely enables faster speeds than 11g. (WiFi is 20MHz and the numbered channels are far less, meaning only channels 1, 6 and 11 do not overlap in their upper/lower frequency bounds).

Some 11n products operate at 5.8GHz. This can help, and add speed, IF your 2.4GHz 11g system is competing for air time with neighbors' systems that are indeed busy (most aren't). And if you cannot find channel 1, 6 or 11 is lightly used in your area.

In 5.8GHz, though, we have lots of cordless phones. The new DECT 6 (in the US) phones are in the 1.9 GHz band devoted ONLY to cordless phones.

I feel that good HD with WiFi is a bad idea. Too little bandwidth. Single channel 11g with an ideal signal strength and no serious interference can deliver 24Mbps at the IP layer for RTP/UDP streaming; about 15% less if TCP is used.

Also, 2.GHz channel-pair bonding, if forced, no matter the neighbors' systems, is kind of rude.

[Brent]

Dear SageTV:
Please add Wifi Support to the HD200. All we need is a little driver support for a specified Wifi donlge (just tell us which one/s work) and then this will be a non-issue.

Will it be perfect? No, but it will satisfy those who just want Wifi.

Here's an example of a wifi USB dongle that would work with the HD200 if SageTV adds support

[stevech]

Originally Posted by Brent

Dear SageTV:
Please add Wifi Support to the HD200. All we need is a little driver support for a specified Wifi donlge (just tell us which one/s work) and then this will be a non-issue.

Will it be perfect? No, but it will satisfy those who just want Wifi.

Here's an example of a wifi USB dongle that would work with the HD200 if SageTV adds support

just buy a WiFi bridge and plug it into the ethernet port and be done with it. It'll probably work better than a WiFi dongle that has a poor antenna position.

But HD and WiFi are not a loving couple.

[fyodor]

You might want to try getting a pair of NIM-100s off of ebay. The NIM-100s are Ethernet bridges that send data over your existing coaxial wiring. I've had really excellent results-much faster, easier to set up, and reliable than wireless. Right now I think you can get them for 35-40 each (you need two, one on each end).

F

Originally Posted by wayner

This device has a USB port - would you be able to plug in a USB wifi adapter and have Sage use this for your network connection rather than using the ethernet port?

I am guessing not but I hope that I am wrong.

If it requires special software/firmware is there any chance that Sage would write that, even if it required one to buy a specific Wireless adapter i.e. this would only work with the Linksys WUSB300N?