Dream Home Entertainment Center?

[TVerb]

So, I want to build my dream entertainment center. I started out with a Windows Home Server based system, and eventually buy SageTV Products. Currently, I have DirecTV HD, WMV DVD ripps, MP3 and MP4 music files, and numerous photos. After thinking about it I decided to go to a Vista with the same functions but with more home PC functions(dvd ripping, various programms)(Though I have not swapped systems yet). Basically, I want to have a set up with PVR, internet streaming(DVD Rips, music, live tv, photos, any/all other media), access for family members(local and out of town), and great quality. I am just dumbfounded with all that SageTV offers, I don't know what I would need from them. I was also thinking about turning my server into and HTPC, or just build and HTPC. I am open to any and all suggestions that are out there. My basic goals(along with above) are, ease of use for family members, reasonable price(work in progress, buy some, buy some later), and use of what I already have(newly built server(no video capture card, just onboard video), DirecTV). If you need more info from me, feel free to ask, I just appreciate the help.

[MitchSchaft]

I'm not sure exactly what your question is. But SageTV does all of the above. I'd go with XP Pro, that way you'll have more resources available for Sage. Vista being a resource hog compared to XP. You won't get any more functionality with Vista anyway (dvd ripping?).

[Slipshod]

I stuck with WHS server in the closet and HD Extenders on the TV. Very, very stable. All the ripping is done from the family-room PC, don't need to do it on the server.

At some point I may add an HTPC in the living room for BluRay playback and emulated classic games, but it will be client-only to keep the server as stable as possible.

I love the current setup, as does the wife. I don't think our home theater has ever had a higher WAF.

[TVerb]

I'm sorry for the confusing. Mostly I am just wondering how other people have there home entertainment centers set up in relation to what I have now. I am also confused with what Sage products I would need to get this going. Sage PVR, Media Extender, Placeshifter? I am mostly worried with compatibility with DirecTV.

[reggie14]

There is only one situation where I recommend Vista over WinXP, and that's dual monitor setups. It doesn't sound like you're going to be doing that, so I think XP would be a much better choice for an OS.

SageTV Media Center is the main program you're going to need running on your computer. There's two ways that you could set this up. You could have a dedicated computer that runs Sage and nothing else. It would just be a server, and other devices (e.g. client computers or media extenders) would connect to TVs and be the devices that actually play back video (pulling the video files off your server over the network). This is the preferred setup, since it's quite a bit more stable. The other option is to use one computer both as a server and as a playback device. Obviously this is cheaper, but it's not as stable. Plus you need to have a big, potentially noisy computer next to your TV, instead of putting it somewhere out of the way.

In either case, you need some way of capturing video on your server. In your case, you're going to need one or more video capture cards, each of which would have to connect to one DirecTV box. Obviously, the more video capture cards and DirecTV receivers you have, the more channels you can watch/record at the same time.

These capture cards would just be recording whatever is being output by your DirecTV receivers. So, you need a way of changing the channels on these receivers. If you ever plan on having more than 1 capture card, you're going to need a USB-UIRT device. It's an IR blaster that connects to your computer and changes channels on your DirecTV boxes using IR signals just like a remote control. If your only going to have one capture card you can just find a capture card that includes an IR blaster.

As for a capture card, it depends on what you want to be able to do. If you want to capture HD video off your receiver, probably your best bet is to buy an Hauppauge HD-PVR. There are other options available. There's a company that would actually modify your DirecTV box so you record directly off of it without a capture card, but it might stop working at any time and is more expensive. If money is no object, the second route is probably preferable, particularly if you were to switch to Dish Networks, but it's probably not worth it. HD-PVRs include an IR blaster, but if you ever want to have two HD-PVRs you would need a USB-UIRT.

If you don't care about capturing HD then there are a lot more options (and they're cheaper too). We can discuss those if you want to go that route.

So now, getting to your original question, what kind of Sage products do you need? Certainly you need SageTV media center. That's the main application that lets you do recording. If you're going to use your computer as both a server and a playback device, then SageTV media center is all you need. If you want separate the server from playback devices (which is preferred), then you need some combination of clients and/or extenders. A client is a computer that you want to connect to Sage. For every client you'll need one license of SageTV Client. But, the better route is probably to buy Sage HD100 Media Extenders for every TV that you want to use Sage on. Media Extenders are specialized playback devices, similar to set-top boxes, that are reasonably priced and completely quiet. (unfortunately, they're also sold out right now.) Media Extenders come with their own license, so you wouldn't need to buy anything else.

Placeshifter is for Internet streaming. Placeshifter licenses are actually the same thing as Media Extender licenses. One license entitles you to have one placeshifter OR media extender connected to the Sage server at a particular time. So, let's say you have one media extender license (and no placeshifter licenses). You could either run a placeshifter client online, or you could use a media extender, but you can't do both. It should be noted that while Placeshifter clients and media extenders share licenses, SageTV Clients are licensed separately. SageTV Client needs a license for every installation.

Does that clear things up?

[jasmithvr6]

Nicely done Reggie. I'm a Sage veteran and don't ever remember seeing a post detailing the inter-workings and capabilities of the various products.

[TVerb]

That certainly does clear up a lot of my confusion. I do have a question about the licensing though, so in order to stream media over the internet and record a television show at the same time I would need two licenses? I was also reading about the Media Extender and how you are able to watch online videos from utube, but a lot of network television is featured on their websites. Would you be able to access those? Is the Media Extender a lot like the an HTPC? What do you all recommend, Media Extender or HTPC? Either way I am guessing I would still need the Hauppauge HD-PVR to send to my server, then from server to media extender/HPTC?

Thanks for all the help, I really appreciate everyone dealing with my obsession...

[bcjenkins]

Originally Posted by TVerb

Thanks for all the help, I really appreciate everyone dealing with my obsession...

We're all obsessed..

B

[MitchSchaft]

I've had no problems running dual monitors in XP and don't remember it being an issue for anyone. Where did that come from?

[paulbeers]

Originally Posted by MitchSchaft

I've had no problems running dual monitors in XP and don't remember it being an issue for anyone. Where did that come from?

From what I understand (I have never tried it), only the primary display is able to use hardware assisted video playback. The Secondardy monitor is all software (i.e. all cpu) powered playback.

[reggie14]

Originally Posted by TVerb

I do have a question about the licensing though, so in order to stream media over the internet and record a television show at the same time I would need two licenses?

If by licenses you mean SageTV Placeshifter/Extender licenses, then no. Recording, and even playback on the SageTV server (and SageTV Clients) do not use licenses per se. A license of SageTV Media Center lets you record and play back on that computer all you want, without using up any other license. A license of SageTV Client lets you play back videos all you want on that client computer without using up Placeshifter/Extender licenses.

The only kind of licenses that go into a pool of maximum allowable simultaneous connections are Placeshifter and Extender licenses.

I was also reading about the Media Extender and how you are able to watch online videos from utube, but a lot of network television is featured on their websites. Would you be able to access those?

I'm not sure I understand your question. You can theoretically access any video on youtube and google video, although personally I'm not thrilled with the interface. You cannot stream video off of, for example, nbc.com, although there is a limited number of shows available (such as Meet the Press and other news shows).

If you're wondering about the license, doing this would use up one of your Placeshifter/Extender licenses. You use up a Placeshifter/Extender license as soon as you turn on an extender, or connect to your server using a Placeshifter client.

Is the Media Extender a lot like the an HTPC? What do you all recommend, Media Extender or HTPC?

Not really. I would say it's a lot like a digital cable box. Really all it has is a network interface, and some computer chips capable of decoding digital video. It doesn't have any built-in storage, or any way of adding storage. It doesn't have TV tuners or video capture cards. It is a specialized device used exclusively for playing back videos stored on a server.

A HTPC, in contrast, would need a lot of storage space to save videos and other files. For our purposes, it would need to have video capture cards. HTPC are full-fledged computers. Extenders are not.

Either way I am guessing I would still need the Hauppauge HD-PVR to send to my server, then from server to media extender/HPTC?

Yes, you certainly need a video capture card hooked up to your SageTV Media Center server computer, and the HD-PVR is really your only option for high-def capture.

Originally Posted by MitchSchaft

I've had no problems running dual monitors in XP and don't remember it being an issue for anyone. Where did that come from?

As paulbeers pointed out, its mostly a hardware acceleration issue, combined with limitations of the VMR9 renderer on XP. You can't do VMR9 with dual monitors in XP. Things will work fine on the primary monitor, but horribly on the secondary monitor. The computer would be doing DirectX emulation on the secondary monitor, which is extremely slow.

Most people running dual monitors with Sage under XP use the overlay renderer. It works for the most part, after turning off hardware acceleration. I did that for a long time when I was just doing standard definition TV, but I couldn't get smooth playback with HD video.

But, VMR9 and hardware acceleration work perfectly on both monitors under Vista.

[inlvnv]

Originally Posted by TVerb

I'm sorry for the confusing. Mostly I am just wondering how other people have there home entertainment centers set up in relation to what I have now. I am also confused with what Sage products I would need to get this going. Sage PVR, Media Extender, Placeshifter? I am mostly worried with compatibility with DirecTV.

Not quite a dream system for me yet, but my entertainment system is set up with WHS and wouldn't have it any other way. (Ease of setup, auto backup of clients etc.) My cable box, HD100 extender, 1 mega dvd changer and a dvd player are all hooked to my 52" TV via HDMI and all upconverts to 1080. I also have an old single core laptop hooked up to the TV cover any file formats not supported by HD100, watch netflix Watch now movies and to occasionally surf the web. My 5 laptops, an iMac and a desktop are scattered throughout the house and are setup to access live/recorded programs and media contents on the server using Sage placeshifter/client software.