Subtitles in Sage Client

[jdivic]

Dear all,

I'm in process of evaluating Sage Media Center + Sage Client. So far everything is very good, but I encountered one serious problem. I have xvid/divx move collection with subtitles in text file (usualy .sub and .srt). I installed Sage CC plug-in, converted subtitles to .smi format, and on main machine (where server resides) everything is playing nice. BUT, on client machine movie is played, but without titles. Of course I installed Sage CC plug-in on the client machine but without any results. So, my question is: Is it possible to get Xvid/DivX .avi movie played on Sage Client from Sage Server with subtitles anyhow?

Thank you all

[Fuzzy]

Sounds like a drive mapping issue. The client needs to see the media/smi files at the same path as the server for it to be able to use the accessory files (like captions, comskip, etc). This can be done by either using UNC paths for sage (on the server, instead of media being stored at 'M:\SagetvRecordgins' or whatever, have them at '\\Server\SageTVRecordings' (obviously with the SageTVRecordings folder shared.

Another way, also involved setting sharing, but by using mapping instead... instead of sharing the SagetvRecordings folder, share the whole M drive, and then on the client, map the share to the M drive... this way the path will be the same whether playing on server, or client.

[jdivic]

Thank you for your kind suggestion, but I already considered that solution and didn't like it because of the way server works. Sage client is "real" client and uses Sage server to get the content, not the file shering mechanism. So, similar to that I would like to get titles throw the Sage server. I took a look at the CC plugin, and problem is in using standard java apis to acces files on local filesystem instead of Sage apis for accesing files throw Sage server. It would be nice if someone has documentation with ALL Sage server APIs. And one question, is it possible to get Sage studio with evaluation version of Sage?

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by jdivic

Thank you for your kind suggestion, but I already considered that solution and didn't like it because of the way server works. Sage client is "real" client and uses Sage server to get the content, not the file shering mechanism. So, similar to that I would like to get titles throw the Sage server.

What drawback are you seeing getting the captioning files through the filesharing mechanism? Also, I believe the client first looks for the media file via sharing, and then if it can't access it (meaning either not UNC or not mapped) THEN it will stream it through the server program. I hve been using sage in client-server for years now using mapped drives, and have never had any issue with it.

[jdivic]

Well, the only real drawback is that all clients have to see all media at same path... I don't like that solution, maybe it isn't real problem, but I simple would prefer that one server has database and access to all media, and all clients just have to connect to server, without any worry about file sharing mechanism, file access rights and so on and so on... I tried to experiment a little with Caption_Playback.stvi¸and I understand it very well. It would be easy to achieve my idea if I only have all Sage server APIs supported. So, please if someone has all Sage Server APIs, please send it to me and I'll change CC plugin to work with server. And if it would be possible I really would love to try Sage Studio before I buy Sage. I'm developer, I have some experience with media software and for now I like SageTV, but I must know much more about it before making final decision. Can someone help me, the clock is ticking, 21 days aren't much for real evaluation and solving all problems.
Thank you

[Fuzzy]

If you simple have the server share the savetg folder, then you can use UNC paths, no need to map network drives or anything. I believe the is the recommended and approved way of doing it. Not sure what else you are looking for.

[jdivic]

I tested the way you recommend, with UNC paths and everything works just fine... but I would like to go one step further... and probably I'll try workaround with SageTV web server... because StartFileDownload is restricted to media files (I read some about it, I agree about security issues, but it would bi nice if function could get reach to files with certain extensions and same directory and filenames, or some other kind of flexibility). So I decided to write a servlet for SageTV server for serving titles, edl files and other supporting media files not allowed to transfer throw the SageTV server.
If I decide to go for Sage I'll set it up with UNC paths for the start, but as soon as I write the servlet I'll switch to that solution and minimize SMB traffic over the network at minimum level.
Maybe I'm little obsessed, but I don't like solution with UNC paths... :-)

[JParedis]

Hmm, I have an HTPC acting as Sage server, have one client on another PC and have an MVP. I don't use the client (it's on my daughter's PC) but intended to get that activated (so I'm allowed to watch my shows on the TV instead of having to participate in watching shows my 11-year daughter likes).

I thought the client and MVP had an identical technical flow, but this thread seems to indicate they don't.

MVP: all is converted - when needed - into mpg2 and sent from server to MVP. Subtitle add-on installed in MVP will include .smi subtitle files (as long in same directory as movie and with same name as movie).

So the client does not work that way ? What does is than do? Does the server sent the movie as is to the client, and has the client to take care of converting is needed (e.g., avi files)? And does the client tries to get the .smi file directly from the server (that really looks odd to me)?

Maybe my question is, can anybody explain the difference between MVP and Client flow (or direct me to the location of that info) - that will probably save me frustration when I work on my client next week. Subtiles are for my daughter a must

Thanks .. Jan

[jdivic]

Well, basically MVP is just rendering engine, as you described it well. Server reads file and mix in subtitle, and then encode it to MPEG2 stream which is the only stream MVP can render. Concept is good, but needs significant amount of processor power on server side to decode mpeg4 (divx, xvid, h.264...) and reencode on the fly to MPEG2.
SageTV Client utilizes processor power of the PC it runs on. Client connects to server and shows imported media files from media library (database). When you choose to play file, Client tries to get it and if it is imported in media library with UNC path (\\machinename\directoryname\filename) then Client will read, decode and render file on its own. In that case it will show subtitles just as they are shown on server. BUT, if your media file resides on Server disk, and it is imported as D:\directory\file Client would ask server to stream it for it (as is). Sage Servers will send file but will not provide subtitles, and Sage subtitles plugin will try to find subtitles on D:\directory\file of local machine... you see the problem. I take a look at code of subtitles plugin, and it is quite easy to make changes to get subtitles from server, but for security reasons Sage Server would not serve any file not evidenced in its media database, and subtitle files certainly are not. So the best shot would be to write small servlet inside Sage web server... I still didn't make decision to switch to Sage, but if I do that, I certainly will do this modifications...

[JParedis]

Originally Posted by jdivic

... When you choose to play file, Client tries to get it and if it is imported in media library with UNC path (\\machinename\directoryname\filename) then Client will read, decode and render file on its own. In that case it will show subtitles just as they are shown on server. BUT, if your media file resides on Server disk, and it is imported as D:\directory\file Client would ask server to stream it for it (as is). Sage Servers will send file but will not provide subtitles, and Sage subtitles plugin will try to find subtitles on D:\directory\file of local machine... you see the problem. ...

Thanks, it does clarify.

As I got all my files on the HTPC server (so not stored with UNC path if I understand correctly), my client will thus not be able to play subtitle's (as it stands today). Bummer, as that's an important feature for my daughter .

... If I understand correctly, if my server has all files under D:Movie/Movie1/, D:Movie/Movie2/ etc., if I would make on the client the same structure only containing the subtitle files, would it than work? Hmm, unless you say no, something I might try ... Not perfect, but at least some solution for my daughter. Else I have to recode all her movies with subtitles included as part of the movie file itself (got to find out again what soft I used, did it once and it did work).

I also seem to understand you could have the files on the server, but still 'force' UNC path storage. How it's that done?
I could than open the separate drive (Raid 5 on server), so my other data would still remain proteced. But my experience with this is bad with XP, never tried to share drives with VISTA (which is more difficult to manage security).

Jan

[jdivic]

Originally Posted by JParedis

As I got all my files on the HTPC server (so not stored with UNC path if I understand correctly), my client will thus not be able to play subtitle's (as it stands today). Bummer, as that's an important feature for my daughter .

No, no, You got it a little bit wrong :-) it doesn't matter where files are... you have to share folders on HTPC server and then in SageTV frontend you have to remove your media dirs as they are now and set new dirs to scan in terms of UNC path... so now your SageTV server has in its library paths like d:\Movie... you have to remove that dir from library and import it as \\HTPCserver\Movie (of course HTPCserver is the name of your HTPC server and Movie is the name of the share)... then all the files would be stored in library under network path so every client would be able to access that network path, so consequently subtitles would be accessible and would be displayed on client... this solution is ok, but it uses windows file sharing mechanism instead SageTV server mechanism... everything would work fine (I tested that and it really works ok with subtitles)... all my posts here are result of my animosity on microsoft file sharing abilities, so I'm not happy with this solution, but it is a working solution

Originally Posted by JParedis

... If I understand correctly, if my server has all files under D:Movie/Movie1/, D:Movie/Movie2/ etc., if I would make on the client the same structure only containing the subtitle files, would it than work? Hmm, unless you say no, something I might try ... Not perfect, but at least some solution for my daughter. Else I have to recode all her movies with subtitles included as part of the movie file itself (got to find out again what soft I used, did it once and it did work).

It also would work (I tested that), but it is not necessary to do...it is complicated and more than less perfect solution... do as I described previously and import your media on server with UNC paths instead of local paths and it will work....

Originally Posted by JParedis

I also seem to understand you could have the files on the server, but still 'force' UNC path storage. How it's that done?
I could than open the separate drive (Raid 5 on server), so my other data would still remain proteced. But my experience with this is bad with XP, never tried to share drives with VISTA (which is more difficult to manage security).

It is quite easy ... you don't have to share whole drive, you share only directories containing media files... and machine where this dirs resides can access them using the UNC path.... I find it quite easy under XP... VISTA... never seen :-))) and until I would be forced to I hope I will not :-)))