How I stopped VMR9 stuttering (including 1080i) and solved all my sound issues.

[mohanman]

Man, I am happy that you guys dont have stuttering anymore, but that means an expensive upgrade to the rest of us. I dont even have a pci-express motherboard. What gets me is that high definition coming in from hdhome run worked fine in media center, and VLC player. But when it came to Sagetv, I got all the stuttering issues which have drove me almost insane over the past 1-2 months. I tried different decoders, different video cards, and now I am happy that someone upgraded the video card and it is gone, but I dont want to be forced to upgrade hardware for something that works fine even in microsoft media center? What gives? Hopefully they can fix this in the next udpates of sagetv.

As for the fan noise from the video cards, I hate noise, noise is irritating. I highly recommend taking that fan off and replacing it with the zalman vga cooler, it does wonders.

Lates!
Mo!

[Keenan]

Originally Posted by Ron

We've got two threads going - the one that I started and the one from GollyJer, and questions are popping up in both places.

As for the fan, I noticed that when the computer starts up, it's really loud, but once XP starts up and Sage loads, it quiets down to a level that I can no longer hear. However my 7900 did the same thing, and that was also manufactured by BFG. Bottom line - fan noise is a non-issue for me.

Someone in the other thread asked about display resolution. I'm running 1360x765, or at least something close to that, which is the native resolution of my display.

From what I've been told, the 8500 and 8600 are made for HDTV, while the 8800 is more for gaming. And I would also think that perhaps the OC may have something to do with it. Whatever, all that matters is that it works. I'm convinced that when Sage was trying to duplicate it, they were probably using a computer monitor, not a home theater display. Reason I say that, is that I'm running two clients. My main HTPC which is where I put in the new video card and the display is my plasma, that's the one that was giving me fits. On the computer I'm on right now, which is my desktop, I also have set up as a Sage client, and my display is a 22" widescreen monitor, resolved at 1680x1050, the video card is an Nvidia 6800, and I have this at VMR9, 3D and FSE, and never had a stutter issue. That's why I believe it's got to be the display/video card combination.

BTW, what's your display that's now stutter free?

You know, I have always felt that was at least part of the problem, the display type/size itself, and I always had the sense that SAGE may have been testing on computer screen/resolutions instead of a "normal" HDTV display type as well.

I'm running the card output to a DVDO VP50 scaler which feeds a 73" CRT-based Mits RPTV. The VP50 output is 1920x1080i RGB. The VP50 shows an input of XGA-60Hz RGB. I haven't even adjusted any of the card output yet as I was so happy it wasn't stuttering when I first installed it. I think I'm going to need to go in and set the output to an HDTV resolution, although the image I'm getting right now is definitely an HD image on the display.

As some background, I never had the stutter problem with 720p content, it was always 1080i and this card/drivers fixed the problem.

Looking around I noticed that there are some fanless 8600 solutions available, I may take a look at one of those, although at this point I'm afraid to cange anything since it works stutter-free finally.

[Keenan]

Originally Posted by mohanman

Man, I am happy that you guys dont have stuttering anymore, but that means an expensive upgrade to the rest of us. I dont even have a pci-express motherboard. What gets me is that high definition coming in from hdhome run worked fine in media center, and VLC player. But when it came to Sagetv, I got all the stuttering issues which have drove me almost insane over the past 1-2 months. I tried different decoders, different video cards, and now I am happy that someone upgraded the video card and it is gone, but I dont want to be forced to upgrade hardware for something that works fine even in microsoft media center? What gives? Hopefully they can fix this in the next udpates of sagetv.

As for the fan noise from the video cards, I hate noise, noise is irritating. I highly recommend taking that fan off and replacing it with the zalman vga cooler, it does wonders.

Lates!
Mo!

Only my opinion, but I wouldn't wait for Sage to fix the problem, I myself have been dealing with it since last year and this card swapout is the only thing that fixed it. I was also waiting for a "fix' to come around, but when Ron posted about the 8600 I took the plunge.

The sad thing is, I still don't think we know anything more about the problem now than we did before about what causes the stuttering.

[Ron]

Originally Posted by Keenan

You know, I have always felt that was at least part of the problem, the display type/size itself, and I always had the sense that SAGE may have been testing on computer screen/resolutions instead of a "normal" HDTV display type as well.

I'm running the card output to a DVDO VP50 scaler which feeds a 73" CRT-based Mits RPTV. The VP50 output is 1920x1080i RGB. The VP50 shows an input of XGA-60Hz RGB. I haven't even adjusted any of the card output yet as I was so happy it wasn't stuttering when I first installed it. I think I'm going to need to go in and set the output to an HDTV resolution, although the image I'm getting right now is definitely an HD image on the display.

As some background, I never had the stutter problem with 720p content, it was always 1080i and this card/drivers fixed the problem.

Looking around I noticed that there are some fanless 8600 solutions available, I may take a look at one of those, although at this point I'm afraid to cange anything since it works stutter-free finally.

Keenan, I totally agree with you. This stutter problem was ONLY with 1080i content, and most noticeable when there was rapid screen movement. Football games really made the stutter stand out. And I know that you and I have had many, many posts on both of these threads, and probably close to pulling our hair out (provided it still applies ). So I'm as thrilled as you.

I would think that all the big name 8600GTS card manufacturers would produce the same quality card. If there's a fanless solution, with a good guaranty, and the fan still bothers you, why not consider the changeout a reasonable low risk. Just my opinion.

[Keenan]

Originally Posted by Ron

Keenan, I totally agree with you. This stutter problem was ONLY with 1080i content, and most noticeable when there was rapid screen movement. Football games really made the stutter stand out. And I know that you and I have had many, many posts on both of these threads, and probably close to pulling our hair out (provided it still applies ). So I'm as thrilled as you.

I would think that all the big name 8600GTS card manufacturers would produce the same quality card. If there's a fanless solution, with a good guaranty, and the fan still bothers you, why not consider the changeout a reasonable low risk. Just my opinion.

Yup, 1080i football was definitely the litmus test for this problem, and I was so frustrated over this issue I was literally hours away from tearing the system down and selling off the R5000-HD modded Star Choice STB and the HDHomeRun and giving up on the whole venture. Your posting about the card, while it cost me money to buy it, actually saved me more money by not taking a loss on all the money I've spent on the above equipment.

Yes, I will probably check out Newegg for a fanless like-speced 8600 and give it a try. I notice though that not all 8600's have the same clock speeds, that will be something to watch out for, as I'm not sure how much, if any, effect that is having on fixing the problem.

[Ron]

Originally Posted by Keenan

Yes, I will probably check out Newegg for a fanless like-speced 8600 and give it a try. I notice though that not all 8600's have the same clock speeds, that will be something to watch out for, as I'm not sure how much, if any, effect that is having on fixing the problem.

I just did a quick check at NewEgg. Gigabyte has a fanless 8600GTS card. However, I didn't compare the specs.

[Crunch]

My wife had said it was time to go get full Time Warner package as we had many of the viewing problems mentioned in this thread.

But I used the settings at the beginning of this thread and comments I found over at silicondust and gave things one last try.
http://www.silicondust.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3403

My main problem was a single line running up the screen or the jump of a frame now and then. Not bad just enough to distract you from what you were watching.

I had tried a couple of Video cards over the last year with no improvement.
GIGABYTE GV-NX795T512H-RH GeForce 7950GT 512MB GDDR3 PCI Express x16 Zalman VF700-AlCu HDCP
GIGABYTE GV-NX76G256D-RH GeForce 7600GS 256MB GDDR2 PCI Express x16 Silent Pipe

The HDHR/silicondust topic had me try a HIS Hightech H165XTP256GDDN-R Radeon X1650XT 256MB 128-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 iSilenceII Video Card. I got a big improvement but the glitch was still there now and then. As changing the card made an improvement I was convinced my Video card was the issue. It was suggested the line I was seeing was interference related. I did change a lot of connections, earths etc but no luck. Changing the card seemed to improve things.

Last week while sifting through Newegg I saw for $140.00 a silent card that was worth a try.

ASUS EN8600GT SILENT/HTDP/256M GeForce 8600GT 128-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 HDCP.

Why not try it I thought. I had read where getting a higher than necessary card didn't achieve much for HDTV and was more for games. I put this card in four days ago and have not had one glitch while viewing HD. I have sat and watched several shows in HD that I wouldn't watch normally waiting to see the glitch... its gone. I seem to have found the card that works in my system.

http://www.newegg.com/product/produc...82E16814121076

This card says DirectX10 etc I installed the drivers that were on the disk, have not updated them as its working.
A check on my system reveals I am still running DirectX9 that I installed when setting up HDHR and SageTV (9.0c 4.09.0000.0904)
Nivida Drivers say 6.14.11.102

I first tried Purevideo Codec Version: 1.02-223 TRIAL (4020.223.0.0)and it was fine.
I had had success with PowerDVD (6.0.0.3614) so put that in and liked it better so am currently running with it.
I am running screen res 1920x1080 on our DLP 56 inch TV. VMR9, Full Screen and 3D.

2 x HDhomeRun (4xQam) Id's 101027DB & 10102E7A ~ AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+(65W) Windsor ~ MBoard ABIT NF-M2 nView AM2 NVIDIA GeForce 6150 Micro ATX AMD ~ G.SKILL 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800Dual Channel ~ Video- ASUS EN8600GT SILENT/HTDP/256M GeForce 8600GT 128-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 HDCP ~ 1 x WD800JD 80GB 8MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s ~ 1 x Seagate 7200.10 ST3320620AS 320GB 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s ~ Win XP Home SP2 ~ D-Link 5-port 10/100/1000 Desktop (DGS-2205) # USB-Uirt ~ Harmony Remote ~ No virus software ~ Windows firewall off ~ TV 56inch Samsung HL-S5687W ~ SageTV

Hope this helps someone.

[Keenan]

Originally Posted by Crunch

I first tried Purevideo Codec Version: 1.02-223 TRIAL (4020.223.0.0)and it was fine.

I didn't think there was a PureVideo version that worked with the 8500/8600 cards available yet, was that recently added?

BTW, I was using a 7600GT and moving to the 8600GTS solved all of my stuttering problems as well.

[Ron]

Originally Posted by Keenan

BTW, I was using a 7600GT and moving to the 8600GTS solved all of my stuttering problems as well.

And still stutter free here, as well. Looks like the 8600GTS and perhaps the GT, too, is the answer.

[swithey]

Originally Posted by Keenan

BTW, I was using a 7600GT and moving to the 8600GTS solved all of my stuttering problems as well.

My move up from the 7600GT to the 8600 GTS (coupled with the NVidia PureVideo driver) fixed my stuttering issues as well.

Anyone interested in a 8 month old Asus fanless 7600GT?

[Ron]

Originally Posted by swithey

My move up from the 7600GT to the 8600 GTS (coupled with the NVidia PureVideo driver) fixed my stuttering issues as well.

Anyone interested in a 8 month old Asus fanless 7600GT?

Given the title of this thread and the reports of stuttering fixed by upgrading the video card, I think that your Asus 7600GT may have to find a home in your box of previously used computer components/cards. I know, mine keeps growing.

[dcardellini]

What to do with three identical systems that have 5-pci-slot AGP mboards??? Sounds like this graphics card is the definitive move that would get me stutter-free (6600gt agp's today)....but no options for AGP'ers???

My current hardware recorded/played hundreds of hd recordings (Fusion5lites) for 1 1/2 years COMPLETELY stutter free...so I know it is feasible with current hardware. Have been waiting for the magic bullet...but this one will be painful for me.

Ironically, my new setup (with SageTV) also includes Firewire HD recordings from a Moto 6412 STB....and these HD programs play stutter-free. Go figure.

[jwillsey]

Hello, just thought I'd throw this in.. but I had a stutter issue as well. I could never identify WHY, but at one point I uninstalled my video driver, then rebooted. Re-installed and rebooted.

All was fixed. This was a nvidia 6800gs running latest drivers.

Unfortunately I had fought with it for 6 hours or so before I tried that and was 5 min away from wiping the box and starting over....

[KJake]

I have a SFF computer hooked to my TV, so I'm limited to half-height/low-profile cards. Any comments on the ATI X1600PRO? I currently have an ATI X600, so I'd have to imagine that this would be a decent upgrade.

Here's the one that I'm looking at specifically:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814102032

I've got a DVI->HDMI setup currently, so I'll be able to use a native HDMI cable now - although I'm not sure that will make any difference (and I'm not interested in audio through the HDMI, I've got a SPDIF for that already.

[Stauf]

I have had numerous troubles with stuttering on my setup and have tried about every solution I have seen in these posts. I have tried with old (and new) drivers and a 6800 card, I have tried with new drivers and a 7900 card (older drivers don't support it) and also the newer drivers with an 8600 GTS card. In every case, I see stutter.

I have a core 2 Duo machine with a 680i motherboard. 2 Gigs of memory, on-board audio or external PCI card, any of the 3 above graphics cards displaying on my projector (which works great driven by another source). Oh, I also purchased the latest PureVideo decoder from Nvidia. I have an HDHomeRun at the moment but the same stuttering also occurred with the DViCO Fusion and the VBox Cat-Eye OTA tuners. Nothing in my system is over-clocked and when running the motherboard resource monitor when watching HDTV, nothing spikes over 20% utilization.

So, you posters with 8600 GTS cards running stutter free, can you tell me the specs of your system? You did not have to do anything special? Does the 8600 GTS require older drivers (which ones) to work properly? Am I doing something stupid with my driver re-installs? I am going into the Control Panel and uninstalling old Nvidia drivers before trying new ones. However, I have had dozens of different installed drivers over the course of my Windows XP Pro's installed lifetime, trying to get this stuttering to stop. Part of me wants to re-install Windows as a last ditch effort. Anyone have any ideas?

Thanks for all the good information guys.

[MeInMaui]

Stauf,

I don't know if this would help, but guru3d has a new free utility called Driver Sweeper that is supposed to remove left-over remnants of previous driver installs. I haven't used this particular utility myself, but I have purchased and used Driver Cleaner which does the same thing (I bought it slightly before the guru3d utility was available).

Aloha,
Mike

[mikesm]

Originally Posted by KJake

I have a SFF computer hooked to my TV, so I'm limited to half-height/low-profile cards. Any comments on the ATI X1600PRO? I currently have an ATI X600, so I'd have to imagine that this would be a decent upgrade.

Here's the one that I'm looking at specifically:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814102032

I've got a DVI->HDMI setup currently, so I'll be able to use a native HDMI cable now - although I'm not sure that will make any difference (and I'm not interested in audio through the HDMI, I've got a SPDIF for that already.

The nvidia 8400gs has full hardware acceleration for blue-way and hd-dvd playback, and is just now beginning to ship. It's a low profile card so should work for you. Cheap too, $70 right now and should be down to $45 soon. 3d performance is not that great, but full video acceleration of the 8600 series.

thanks,
mike

[samgreco]

I just got the fanless Gigabyte 8500GT and for the first time ever, I can use VMR9 with FSE . I haven't put my Avermedia A180 back in yet to try HD, but SD is finally perfect. I am pleased.

As soon as I get a chance to try HD. I'll report back.

[PhillJones]

Looks like there aren't AGP versions of these cards.

I can't use overlay with my display

I guess nearly smooth is as good as I'm ever gonna get.

[stewart710]

I'm just waiting for the 8600gt cards to come down in price some more, before I jump in. I play some games, so I don't want anything less than the 7600gt that I already have, but I don't feel like dropping another ~$120 into the moneypit that SageTV has turned into. Especially considering that was the reason I spent the money on the 7600gt in December. SageTV techs also continue to claim that the 7600gt and the 3800x2 cpu are more than enough to accomplish HD with VMR9 without stutters. I wish I had bought their "magic combination" of parts that allow this feat .

For the people who claim the 8500 and 8600 series solved their problems, is that still the case? thanks.