First Venture into HDTV

[jphhughes]

I got a 50 inch Panasonic Plasma TV for Christmas. So now I want to upgrade my SageTV box with ATSC/QAM tuners. After reading various posts on the forum it look like the current popular choices are the HDHomeRun and the OnAir GT mobile. I have the following questions and would appreciate any answers or advise from current users of these devices.

1. On the basis of what I have read it seem that you simply need to connect the Cable directly to either device and scan for unencrypted channels (no STB needed). Is this correct?
2. My current needs call for only one HD capture device and one SD capture device. However seeing that the cost of the HDHomeRun is almost the same as the OnAir GT, can I just connect one of the HDHomeRun tuners and not use the second until needed some time in the future.
3. Does anyone know what HD channels are unencrypted on the Cablevision Oakland digital lineup or how to find out? The current batch of HD channels is in the 700 range and includes all of the network channels (CBS, NBC ABC etc) however I am using Cablevision’s Scientific Atlantic 4200HD STB to currently view these.

Regards,

[ybrew]

I've got an HDHomerun connected to an antenna for now, so can't answer to many questions - other than to say you most certainly can only enable one tuner at a time on the HDHomerun if you so desire.

I can't imagine why you wouldn't connect both, but you certainly have the choice.

[gplasky]

Questions from jphhughes

1. On the basis of what I have read it seem that you simply need to connect the Cable directly to either device and scan for unencrypted channels (no STB needed). Is this correct?

I have the HDHomerun. This will plug into your ethernet network to talk to Sage. Then split a cable connection and connect both tuners. No reason not to use both.

2. My current needs call for only one HD capture device and one SD capture device. However seeing that the cost of the HDHomeRun is almost the same as the OnAir GT, can I just connect one of the HDHomeRun tuners and not use the second until needed some time in the future.

Keep in mind the HDHomerun only does digital and no analog. You'll need another tuner to grab analog. Don't split the discussion between HD and SD. HDHomerun is digital only but digital is transmitted in both HD and SD.

3. Does anyone know what HD channels are unencrypted on the Cablevision Oakland digital lineup or how to find out? The current batch of HD channels is in the 700 range and includes all of the network channels (CBS, NBC ABC etc) however I am using Cablevision’s Scientific Atlantic 4200HD STB to currently view these.

For the most part, your locals should be unencrypted. Doesn't matter what setbox you have. You can connect the cable from the wall directly.





Gerry

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by jphhughes

3. Does anyone know what HD channels are unencrypted on the Cablevision Oakland digital lineup or how to find out?

If you're TVs new (and it sounds like it is), it should have a "Digital Cable Ready" tuner, and you should be able to simply connect the coax to the TV and scan channels. Whatever digitals your TV finds, the HDHR should be able to get.

[Diginerd]

Heyas,

I'm in lower Fairfield county, CT. Cablevision - Oakland crops up when I put in my zip code into sage. In fact I use the Oakland lineup for my analog tuners. Whilst not 100% certain I'd imagine that CableVision has the same policy wih regard to 5c/ QAM in Oakland as well as CT (Norwalk) as our channel lineups are practically identical.

If I was you get the HD Homerun. "It just works"(tm) two tuners is cake to setup, connects via the network so no USB / PCI issues, and it's MUCH easier than the US-GT to configure, also I hve had limitedsuccess with 2 x USB-GT in one box..

And finally, here's my list of channels in the clear and frequencies, yours will be very similar if not identical...

Master List(Cablevision Norwalk)
+++++++++++

Physical-Sub / CALLSGN / (Cablevision Logical Channel)
94-29 WCBS (2)
#109-101 WFSB (3)
94-30 WNBC (4)
94-31 WNYW (5)
#109-105 WVIT (6)
94-32 WABC (7)
#109-102 WTNH (8)
94-33 WWOR (9)
117-209 WEDW (10)
94-34 WPIX (11)
117-12 N12HV (12)
94-35 WNET (13)
117-210 WSAH (14)
#109-49 WLNY (15)
#109-40 WNJU (16)
#109-44 WFUT (17)
94-37 WXTV (18)
#109-42 WRNN (19)
#109-103 WTXX (20)
94-36 WLIW21 (21)
#109-39 WNYE (22)
94-38 WPXN (23)
82-8 QVC (80)
82-4 HSN (81)
113-16 SNBC (82)
117-3 CT-N (83)
103-82 iODG (100)
92-108 7NOW (117) (accuweather) == Check
101-109 NBCWP (118) NBC Weather Plus == Check
101-110 NBC44 (119) == Check
118-6 13KDS (131)
118-7 13WLD (132)
92-2 21CRT (133)
99-184 TUBE (184)

118-8 CBSHD (702)*
101-704 NBCHD (704)*
101-705 FOXD (705)*
92-4 ABCHD (707)*
99-709 My9HD (709)*
92-1 21NY (721)*
99-16 CW11HD (711)*
118-5 13HD (713)*

*= HD
#= Dubious Tuning (potentially Electrical interference on my side)

Unallocated
++++++++++++

82-103 RELI
104-51 NBAC NBA Preview Channel
92-3 ABC+ == Check
#109-107 WTIC (5)

[jphhughes]

Thanks for all the replys and detailed information. Diginerd the 700 channels are the same as my lineup. I will try stanger89 suggestion and see what channels I can tune using the TV internal tuner, just to make sure. The TV is model TH-50PX60U 50" Diagonal Plasma HDTV with Built-In ATSC/QAM/NTSC Tuners and SD Memory Card Slot.

[mogrinz]

Awesome Diginerd,

I'm in Easton and just got my hdhomerun yesterday. You got a few channels that I accidentally missed. Thanks for the post.

[jphhughes]

Well I hooked up the cable to the TV ANT in and did a Scan on Cable in "all mode" which according to the manual should scan analog and digital channels. The progression bar first show "scanning analog channels" then "scanning Digital Channels". And the end it show a listing of all channels it picked up with either a yes or no listed next to it. I then saved these as per the manual . I then ried to view the channels with no luck at all. I simply went to channel 90 and started using the up channel and although it showed channels from 99-115 range with sub channels none were viewable. It always gave a error mess of "channel not avaliable". I did get one channel to show and that was 115-2 called "SHO".

Its my understanding that I should have at least gotten the major networks as discussed above. Could it be that the tuner card in the TV is just not up to par?

So any additional suggestions would be appreciated.

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by jphhughes

Its my understanding that I should have at least gotten the major networks as discussed above. Could it be that the tuner card in the TV is just not up to par?

Well, I've seen cable systems that either don't provide locals in HD, or don't provide them in the clear. You might want to check the Reception thread on AVS Forum for your area and see if anyone else is getting anything.

[zoso]

Something to check would be if there are 2 coax inputs for your TV. Mine has one for Cable and one for Antena.

[jphhughes]

ZOSO, no only one connection. the Scanning for channels setup dictates if ota or cable channels are scanned.

[jphhughes]

I tried Stanger89 suggestion and visited the AVS reception forum. I found two threads that more or less imply that clear qam channels are available.

Quotes:
I posted these a while ago:

Here are my QAM channels, Oakland, NJ system
CBSHD 110.8
PBSHD 110.6
NBCHD 101.704
FOXHD 101.705
WB HD 100.16
ABCHD 105.4

I think YESHD is 100.15


Other Non-HD channels
13WOR 110.7
PBS K 110.6
WLIW 105.1
CREATE 105.2

Hope this helps someone.

AS PROMISED!!

Below is the QAM Mapping via clear qam built in tuner of Bergen Cablevision broadcast network HD channels...

0 : ABC HD

110-004 : CBS HD

101-002 : NBC HD (my two cents = the best broadcast network hd pq overall)

101-001 : FOX HD

These are the ones i actually care for but my9, wliw, pbs, etc. were found as well but i deleted them as i never watch those.

hope this helps in manually mapping qam broadcast network hd channel
End Quotes

Both of these were posed November 06 so they are not too old. It also appears that channels differ between towns. Okland should be meaningful to me. Bergen is closer to NYC, but still in NJ. Some of the channels for Oakland NJ match Diginerd channels but not all do. So why is my tuner not getting these.

[bcjenkins]

Is it possible you have a filter installed on your line? Have you tried contacting your cable co?

B

[jphhughes]

Not likley but the cable configurations might be a problem. The cable company actually installed a splitter off the main coax which feeds five connections two of which are fed to a cable company provided amplifier to help with long runs to other parts of the house. Previously I had two SD cable boxes connected to My Sagetv box as well as a thrid connection directly to my old SD RPTV.

When I installed the new Plasma TV I connected direct coax and realized I was not getting any HD content so I got a HD box from the Cable company so I could start enjoying HD immediately. So my point here is that all of these connections should be ok as it comes to signal strength etc. My Cablevision subscription is IO Silver which gives me all of the digital channels and all of the HD channels and a half dozen premium channels such as HBO Starz etc.

I am starting to suspect the problem may be with the Plasma Tuner, but that just a guess.

[jphhughes]

Being one that has learned not to take no for an answer I contacted Panasonic to see if they had any info on possbile problems with their tuner, the result was no. So then I contacted Cablevison oakland and they firmly stated I cannot get any of the network Channels in HD without their box(still not sure I believe them). SO I guess I will not be buying a HD tuner any time soon. Bummer

[bcjenkins]

According to some light reading.. http://www.fcc.gov/Bureaus/Cable/New...factsheet.html

I think they have to provide anything OTA ATSC which they have retransmission rights to, via basic tier services.

good luck interpreting it though ;-)

[jphhughes]

I guess the real trick is to find a contact point at the Cable company to take this issue up with.

[bcjenkins]

I believe you can file complaint with the FCC too.

[jphhughes]

I sent off an email with your document as an attachment. They calim they will respond in three days. So will let everyone know if I get anything.

[jphhughes]

I did some follow up with Cablevision by sending the document bcjenkins had pointed me to and received the following reply.(this was a second reply the first one completely avoided the my question)

"Thank you for your email. I understand your concern and will be happy to assist you.

I apologize to you if my response was unclear.

HD networks send out HD frequency, which means if a customer has an HD compatible television they will be able to receive some programs in HD format.

HD channels like CBSHD, NBCHD and so on bring in 24/7 HD programs.

In order to view the channels IE: CBSHD, NBCHD, in HD format you would need a cable box or cable card to descramble the frequency for that channel.

If a customer has an HD television without a cable box or cable card, they will not receive the HD networks only the programs that are in HD format.

This is what Cablevision is required to provide for customers who wish to receive the channels is HD format.

If you would like a phone call from me to explain this, I will be happy to contact you.

If you have any other questions or concerns, please let us know.

Or for immediate assistance please contact your local Customer Service department.

Customer service is available to you 24 hours a day, 7 days a week for your convenience.

Thank you for choosing Cablevision."

After reading this several times I'm still not sure what it says. Parts seem to say " that yes you can receive HD content" but other parts seem to say "No not without a cable box. " Anyone care to Interpret ?