Bouncing video

Wheemer · #1 01-20-2005, 02:51 AM

I've got a Shuttle client box with a celeron 1.7 and 384 megs of ram. It's got an intel 845 chipset and a FX 5500 video card. I am experiencing bouncing video, especially text, with VMR 9 and the Nvidia 1.00.67 decoder.

I've tried this video card in my P4 3.0 machine and it plays back smooth as silk and looks amazing. So I do not think the problem is related to the video card. If I use "pixel adaptive" deinterlacing in Nvidia decoder it does not bob, however it jerks on pans pretty bad and tickers look jerky constantly. When I try to use my prefered "median filtering" in the decoder the tickers and pans look fine, but this is where I get the bounce happening. It looks like the feild order is switching constantly.

Does anyone have any suggestions for me?

Thank You

mdmint · #2 01-20-2005, 03:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wheemer

I've got a Shuttle client box with a celeron 1.7 and 384 megs of ram. It's got an intel 845 chipset and a FX 5500 video card. I am experiencing bouncing video, especially text, with VMR 9 and the Nvidia 1.00.67 decoder.

I've tried this video card in my P4 3.0 machine and it plays back smooth as silk and looks amazing. So I do not think the problem is related to the video card. If I use "pixel adaptive" deinterlacing in Nvidia decoder it does not bob, however it jerks on pans pretty bad and tickers look jerky constantly. When I try to use my prefered "median filtering" in the decoder the tickers and pans look fine, but this is where I get the bounce happening. It looks like the feild order is switching constantly.

Does anyone have any suggestions for me?

Thank You

We'll if the same video card playing back with the same drivers and settings smooth as silk in a P4 3.0 while video bouncy in Celeron 1.7 it seems the main difference is likely what? CPU maybe? Did the 5500 ever play the way you want it in the Celeron box? If not maybe it won't.

Wheemer · #3 01-20-2005, 03:25 AM

Nope... I also have a GF MX 440 that plays perfectly on the P4 and bad on the Celeron...

CPU usage with the Celeron is only 40-50% though... I can't understand why it would affect playback unless it was pegging.

taltman · #4 01-20-2005, 03:34 AM

What OS are you using? Is it Windows XP with Direct X 9.0c? What exactly is bouncing text? Are you describing panning issues where it studders?

There is a known fix - lookup the quartz.dll file. There is an updated one that fixed my studdering/panning issues...

/tdog

mdmint · #5 01-20-2005, 03:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wheemer

Nope... I also have a GF MX 440 that plays perfectly on the P4 and bad on the Celeron...

CPU usage with the Celeron is only 40-50% though... I can't understand why it would affect playback unless it was pegging.

Different mobo chipsets I presume. If so maybe the Celeron mobo just does't play well with NVidia cards. (If it's not the Dx9c SP2 quartz.dll issue)

Wheemer · #6 01-20-2005, 03:49 AM

It is Windows XP SP2, however I've already changed the quartz.dll (I was the one who originally posted that fix).

The quartz.dll problem for me was more like a weird deinterlacing/frame drop effect. Whereas this is perfectly fine video and panning, however the entire image is shifting up or down 1 row... It's not very apparent on plain jane video content. But on displated text it's serious, the text is jumping up and down 1 row... I realize "row" is not the proper term, but I'm not sure how else to refer to it.

It would be a shame if it had something to do with the chipset. However I can't say I didn't think of that right away. The first thing I did was download the latest chipset drivers from Intel, however they had no effect. I've heard of incompatibilities with VIA chipset, but I though the 845 Intel chipset was not a contender.

mdmint · #7 01-20-2005, 04:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wheemer

It is Windows XP SP2, however I've already changed the quartz.dll (I was the one who originally posted that fix).

The quartz.dll problem for me was more like a weird deinterlacing/frame drop effect. Whereas this is perfectly fine video and panning, however the entire image is shifting up or down 1 row... It's not very apparent on plain jane video content. But on displated text it's serious, the text is jumping up and down 1 row... I realize "row" is not the proper term, but I'm not sure how else to refer to it.

It would be a shame if it had something to do with the chipset. However I can't say I didn't think of that right away. The first thing I did was download the latest chipset drivers from Intel, however they had no effect. I've heard of incompatibilities with VIA chipset, but I though the 845 Intel chipset was not a contender.

This is the one (and ONLY IMO) advantage TIVO has over Sage, they don't have to worry about hardware incompatibilities. But software & hardware incompatibility problems really nothing new of course. It all started way back when IBM first made their first PC design available and IBM clones came on the seen. Now everything is an IBM clone and IBM is out of the PC business! Zillions of different hardware designers and manufacturers with zillions of different software coders attempting to follow zillions of different specs... It's amazing PCs work as well as they do!

All else fails bite the bullet and get a NV2 chipset mobo and cheap mid 2k AMD XP. HTPC Client and Server working rock solid for me that platform. (It did take me switching from ATI 9600 to GF 6600GT to be satisfied with my HTPC vid VMR9 component output performance.)

Wheemer · #8 01-20-2005, 04:17 AM

That would really be bad if the only solution was to change my hardware. Beyond TV in exclusive fullscreen mode worked perfectly fine with my GF MX 440... The text bounced without exclusive fullscreen in the same way I'm experienceing with Sage.

I would be much happier if beta 2.2.4 included exclusive fullscreen. It's seems like a lot of the suggested fixes I see for Sage include upgrading hardware. This shouldn't have to be the only solution...

Wheemer · #9 01-20-2005, 11:39 AM

I tried the adjustments mentioned here: http://forums.freytechnologies.com/f...3413#post83413 and I set my Nvidia decoder to auto instead of smart. I'm also using a batch file to launch the client in high priority mode.

All these changes have made a noticeable difference. I'm not getting a stutter every few seconds. This is much better than the constant bouncing I was experiencing before.

It seems I'm only a few tweak away from fixing this. I'm hoping Frey find something within Sage to fix in the next update.

Oh, I also turned off virtual memory, as with Sage client running it never uses up all my actual ram. Is there any drawbacks to this?

Any other tweaks anyone can think of?

Thanks!

Wheemer · #10 01-21-2005, 04:19 PM

Just an update: I had another PC that I swapped with. It's an AMD Athlon 1400 with 384 megs of ram and I used the same FX 5500 video card. Went through and updated all the drivers and everything. Loaded up Sage Client and I'm having the exact same problem.

So now I am convinced this has nothing to do with my hardware. This is definately a problem with Sage. For the most part scrolling tickers are smooth, except they hickup every second. The initial major problem of the text bouncing all the time seems to be gone. But this bounce/hickup every second is basically just as annoying and unwatchable.

My CPU usage with the Nvidia decoder is around 30%. I've tried the suggestions in the beta thread and they do not change anything.

Any other helpful advice? This is really driving me crazy.

Thanks a lot!

taltman · #11 01-21-2005, 07:55 PM

Have you tried testing the playback with other video renders / codecs?

I have a weaker card than you and I'm doing ok with Overlay. When I use VRM (did i spell that right?) the playback is not as smooth sometimes.

I've also tried playing with different codecs as well. The happauge codecs are decent with overlay, NVDVD is good also.

On a side note I am playing around with FFdShow as well and it has amazing postprocessing power. Unfortunetly I my video card can't keep up with it beyond 720x480p.

What resolution are you running? Are you using powerstrip for custom timings?

Wheemer · #12 01-21-2005, 08:10 PM

I'm currently using the Nvidia DVD decoder 1.00.67. I have tried the hauppauge aswell. In overlay the image look perfect, however the CC looks horrible. They flash on and off and the text is terrible looking. CC is a requirement for me. So that's why I want to nail down VMR9, since the CC look perfect. It seems I am just a hair away from perfect playback. What I'm experiencing is not that of an underpowered video or anything. It's the same thing that happen if the cpu spikes, however the cpu never spike at all. Like just a moment of hesitation. It's really annoying, because I know my setup should work properly without any hassles. There is definately something in Sage that's causing this. Beyond TV looks perfect and Zoomplayer looks perfect playing back one of the Mpeg2 I recorded aswell.

I'm only running s-video out to an SDTV so I have had the need for powerstrip or ffdshow.

willemse · #13 01-22-2005, 08:19 AM

Wheemer,

At what percentages are your Horz & Vert set for Source Aspect Ratio Settings??

Wheemer · #14 01-22-2005, 01:54 PM

Since there really was no improvement by using 720 x 480, I have switched back to 800 x 600. While using 720 x 480 though, I had the verticle set to 104% and the horizontal seto to 125%.

Now at 800 x 600 they're both set to 104%.

willemse · #15 01-22-2005, 03:00 PM

Try both set to 100%. It helped in my situation where picture was stuttering.

Cayars · #16 01-22-2005, 04:17 PM

I have this to be the case also. 720x480 with scaling at 100%. The way it comes in is the way it goes out. The less the computer "adjusts" things the cleaner/stutter free the picture is for many.

willemse · #17 01-22-2005, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willemse

Try both set to 100%. It helped in my situation where picture was stuttering.

Did it any good for your situation??

Wheemer · #18 01-22-2005, 04:47 PM

Well I won't be able to try this at 720 x 480, since the image displays compressed horizontally. I will try this at 800 x 600 and let you guys know how it goes. I'm assuming I can then adjust the graphics card driver's adjustments to enlarge thedges off screen... Will that work?

willemse · #19 01-22-2005, 05:06 PM

Yes you should be able to do so.
I use a club-3d FX5200 with 66.93 driver from club-3d. In the driver you can adjust screen sizes etc

Cayars · #20 01-22-2005, 05:27 PM

For SDTV anything higher then 720x768 and you're asking your computer to do extra work and you're degrading your image in the process.

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