SageTV acquired by Google

[wado1971]

Originally Posted by hufnagel

The problem is I don't want to Think BIG. To me SageTV is like a very finely focused and specialized tool. It does its job in such a perfect way and is nearly as close to appliance-like as any software could get. And with the 3rd party people out there to help extend it and customize it in specific ways what more could you actually want?

I agree in a way but I don't think sagetv could have satisfied it's customer base for much longer. Sage astounded me with the placeshifter, impressed me with HD recording support (pvr-2250 & hd-pvr), and then satisfied me with the UI update. Many other features added along the way which kept me interested and impressed. Thing is, they've recently run into some mountains too big for a small company to handle. One is cablecard support (too bureaucratic), Second, is native netflix (too small user base). And third is the UI update - they even admitted that it wasn't exactly the outcome they anticipated as they're hired gun for the job basically failed and they had to do it in-house. It is obvious (looking back the last 2 yrs) that sagetv was facing some challenges, which if not finished, would have eventually had you looking for alternatives.

[Karride]

Originally Posted by lfilomeno

...(my wife and kids) have only one thing to say the other day: " Once you got the SageTV going without problems, it is almost impossible to watch TV any other way."

My wife is the same way. When we started dating I had a mature and stable Sage server on an HTPC client in the living room. She always hated going back home to her parents because she had to watch commercials and the EPG from Comcast was "craptastically slow". Today I'm using all extenders and she hates going to anyone elses house and trying to watch TV.

I intend to run Sage as long as possible, hopefully until Google does something awsome with what they just bought. If that doesn't happen, and when I can no longer make Sage usable. I'll probably save myself some headaches and just use a provider DVR like a normal person .

[rparker]

What I am thinking will end up happening.
Is that google will strip out what parts of sagetv they want. Shutdown the way it works now. and then sell is as a set top box with very limited local storage. but access to the cloud.

[tvmaster2]

it still boggles my mind why Netflix seems so important to people...stuttering video...no 5.1 surround...no Placeshifting abilities (I was out of the country where there was very little English media, just where you'd like access to Netflix, but DRM won't let Netflix operate outside the U.S. once your ip is detected). Most of all, the model of massive amounts of streaming will result in one thing only: bandwidth caps/overages/charges.
Wee .. Netflix is so awesome.
If anything, Netflix is likely one of the biggest reasons why Sage sold out and left us where we are.
great

[stuckless]

Originally Posted by tvmaster2

it still boggles my mind why Netflix seems so important to people...stuttering video...no 5.1 surround...no Placeshifting abilities (I was out of the country where there was very little English media, just where you'd like access to Netflix, but DRM won't let Netflix operate outside the U.S. once your ip is detected). Most of all, the model of massive amounts of streaming will result in one thing only: bandwidth caps/overages/charges.
Wee .. Netflix is so awesome.
If anything, Netflix is likely one of the biggest reasons why Sage sold out and left us where we are.
great

I do agree with some of that... but I think that with the inception of DVRs many people, including myself, no long think in terms of "channels" and "what's on now"... instead we open media front end, and navigate to something that we want to watch (pre-recorded) and watch it now. If you forget for a moment that Netflix is streamed in real time, then a netflix front-end, is very similar to my dvr front-end in that I simply navigate to some movie/tv and watch what I want, when I want.

All that being said... It's a little hard to forget that Netflix is being streamed when you get hit with an overage bill or when you start to watch a netflix show/movie and you get a message "Netflix is experiences issues", which I've gotten several times now

I think at some point (not in the near future, perhaps) that TV will be an on-demand experience where I choose to watch CSI or Mythbusters, and it don't care if it's on at 9:30pm on channel 817.. which is pretty much how I watch tv now with sagetv.

[rgroves]

Ok, I just sat a read through the entire thread.

First - CONGRATS to teh SAGETV Team. All your hard work over the years has fianlly paid off.

Second - Jeff and them are under NDA's from Google, so they CANNOT say anything. Many of hte comments on here are knee-jerk reactions, and speculation. I for one plan on waiting to hear the official word from Jeff and the SageTV\Google team on the future of the products.

Just because the site (except for the forums), has been shut down, doesn't mean they won't come back. There is a trasition period withhte buyout\merger of Google and SageTV that has to take place. Legal paperwork has to be filed, paperwork submitted, business licenses, taxes, talks, etc... before the "new" site can be revealed to the public. Besides, anything that has the SageTV logo on it has to be changed, web site, extenders, software packages, email addresses (yes, I know a simple DNS change and a few email rules can handle that part), etc.. has to be changed as well.

Jeff and the team have to meet with people @ Google, lawyers, marketing reps, accounts people, sales, etc... and those things in place before the store-front can re-open.

I'm sure Jeff and them have lots of HD300's still in stock, and now have to get new faceplates for them and update the rest of their inventory before they can legally sell any remaining product they have in stock. Not to mention the software changes that have to happen.

Jeff and them are probably super busy right now, and if and when they get to go out and celebrate their bar tab will look something like this.... http://eater.com/uploads/Bruins-Bar-Tab-Full.jpg LOL

Moral to the story.... CALM DOWN, Wait a few days, let the smoke clear, the dust settle, and see where everything falls. Once Jeff and them CAN give us hte bigger picture, those that want to bash him for his actions, can go on their merry way. And those that wish to remain can, and will....and secretly buy up any software or hardware that may appear on certain sites.....not that anyone one here would EVER think of doing that.

[SHS]

Originally Posted by lfilomeno

I am also sticking around with Sage since the EPG service will be around for a year at least. I am eye balling the Moxi HD PVR and its clients since it is very close to my SageTV setup but that is long term. I remember when I was setting up my SageTV network 3 years ago: The wife was upset with all the kinks found along the way, ugly front end screens and the like. But after the upgrades, new skins, plugins, emails to Geoge for support and stability of the system, they (my wife and kids) have only one thing to say the other day: " Once you got the SageTV going without problems, it is almost impossible to watch TV any other way." SageTV is a great product. Very sad to see it leave the HTPC scene.

You better take look at the thread on AVSForum about Moxi becuase people over there are saying Moxi is a dead product too. Development has pettey much stopped. Moxi was long dead before it even got started the fact is wasn't very expandable and over price and limited number of tuner oh has no input analog support.

[tvmaster2]

Originally Posted by stuckless

I do agree with some of that... but I think that with the inception of DVRs many people, including myself, no long think in terms of "channels" and "what's on now"... instead we open media front end, and navigate to something that we want to watch (pre-recorded) and watch it now. If you forget for a moment that Netflix is streamed in real time, then a netflix front-end, is very similar to my dvr front-end in that I simply navigate to some movie/tv and watch what I want, when I want.

All that being said... It's a little hard to forget that Netflix is being streamed when you get hit with an overage bill or when you start to watch a netflix show/movie and you get a message "Netflix is experiences issues", which I've gotten several times now

I think at some point (not in the near future, perhaps) that TV will be an on-demand experience where I choose to watch CSI or Mythbusters, and it don't care if it's on at 9:30pm on channel 817.. which is pretty much how I watch tv now with sagetv.

sadly, people are too stupid to use DVR's. I have a family member who pays rental on three cable company DVR's and every premium movie channel, but instead orders $3.99 on demand films because they cant figure out how to search, program and record with said DVR's. The only reason TiVo still exists is because their software guide made that easy for people to do. Mostly. Sage was the only product that gave us the best of both worlds...transparency and ease of use. Sadly, it ran on a computer and crashed.
Maybe it's time to pull my JVC S-VHS machines out of the closet...lol

[mechling-burgh]

Well I'm glad to see Jeff's hard work has hopefully paid off for him and his company. But I'm also sad because I know SageTV as I have known it since version 2 is gone. But I keep hoping it will work out. I know Google bought a company called SketchUp, which we use at work. I thought for sure it would be gone, but what Google did was make a basic free version so people could make models to put in Google Maps. Then the Company makes a paid version for the Architects and such with many more features. I'm hoping that Google has the same idea here. To have Jeff and them make a basic server package that will interface with Google TV and have a pay package that can also do more with. I think Jeff has put to much time and energy into SageTV to just let it die. I know he has to think of his employees first but he has always seemed to want to do right by his customers. Remember when SageTV first started it was free upgrades but that he soon realized he had to change that model to survive as a business. I'm hoping this is just a change like the paying for upgrades and if not my system will still run for a long while.

[planetc]

My daughter is nine in a couple of weeks, she has never watched tv any other way, it's always been Sage for her.
I feel the vibes from Jeff are all positive at this time, and if that changes it's not a major issue, I have more client licenses than I need currently and already have to outsource my epg. If Google move it forward then it's a bonus.
I feel for those that are in limbo though, and hope it comes good for them.

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by moothekow

License can say you owe SageTV your first born child too - doesn't necessarily mean it would hold in court.

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/n...d-software.ars

This court decision was overturned on Sep 10, 2010 in appeals. That, however, is a different situation, where AutoDesk is still offering licensed of AutoCAD. Google is NOT still offering licenses of SageTV, therefore, I can't see how any value can be placed on the 'licenses', and therefore, no damages can be assessed.

they (google), DO of course have the right to say you can't sell the licenses here on their forums.

[brainbone]

Originally Posted by tvmaster2

it still boggles my mind why Netflix seems so important to people...stuttering video...

Some encodings on Netflix are better than others, but most of the recent ones seem to be relatively good quality, provided you have enough bandwidth.

Originally Posted by tvmaster2

no 5.1 surround...

PS3 has it, but yes, this would be nice to have everywhere. I expect it will happen eventually.

Originally Posted by tvmaster2

no Placeshifting abilities (I was out of the country where there was very little English media, just where you'd like access to Netflix, but DRM
won't let Netflix operate outside the U.S. once your ip is detected).

It's easy to set-up your own VPN. When on public networks, I prefer to use my VPN anyway. I've used this to watch Netflix while abroad and it works well. When traveling inside the US, it's not a problem at all (unless you are in a location without enough bandwidth).

Originally Posted by tvmaster2

Most of all, the model of massive amounts of streaming will result in one thing only: bandwidth caps/overages/charges

Going forward, this may be the biggest issue. We'll have to see how it plays out.

[Torkild]

Originally Posted by planetc

My daughter is nine in a couple of weeks, she has never watched tv any other way, it's always been Sage for her.
I feel the vibes from Jeff are all positive at this time, and if that changes it's not a major issue, I have more client licenses than I need currently and already have to outsource my epg. If Google move it forward then it's a bonus.
I feel for those that are in limbo though, and hope it comes good for them.

x2

I'm sad that sage is no more, but Jeff is the man to teach Google how to make GTV (like sage, but better).

[najames]

Jeff:
Quote:
The beta versions do not expire. SageTV/Google does not currently have plans relating to posting a final release of V7.1; the current release candidate is of 'release' quality based on SageTV’s prior standards.


Does the SageTV beta software cease to function in 21 days or not?

As posted earlier, I had just built and tweaked an AMD unRaid server to idle at 41W with 3 drives, got my new SageTV i3-550 box to idle at 35W. I had just downloaded/installed the SageTV 7 beta server software, was up at about 4am (bad Sage dreams so I got up ) & headed to buy a key when I found the store died the previous day.

I need to find the license for my SageTV 6 software just in case I can only use the old version. I am using WHS v1 for the current server, can stuff be migrated off to another server using Acronis or something just in case I can't find it? I'll have a totally different drive configuration in the new box than the old one (small OS drive & move recordings to the unRaid hopefully, vs a couple 1TB and a couple 750GB in the old box)?

Over 2 years, the Q6600 WHS server has been extremly reliable and uptime is currently 106 days, normally 6mo + at a time. I reset my HDPVR once this year, think I also reset the HDHomerun once/twice too since I owned it. I had a new copy of Vista64 laying around and 8GB of RAM for the new server so I was going to change the OS.

I am not in any crisis modes to dump my SageTV setup, it works very well and has a HIGH WAF. I was just hoping to make the SageTV 7 setup even better. Just updated all 3 HD200s to the latest firmware too.

[polen]

I’m not positive about this, but has Google ever sold hardware to consumers. Phones, tablets and GoogleTV are all made and sold by other companies, so why would they change their MO and sell the HD300 or make a SageTV appliance?

Google just bought a mature, stable and seasoned product. All they need to do is make it work with GoogleTV and they will have a better solution then the big almighty Microsoft Media Center and a huge leap forward from AppleTV, which is now moving to build smart TVs. Smart TVs are the next step and whoever has the better backend to the Smart TV will be the winner.

I work in IT and have seen buy outs of software we use. The product continues and an update will come out where the logo and name is changed, but when you dig into the code/directories you will still see the old name in places. If the store does open, I see them selling the SageTV software, but not the hardware, but I might be wrong. Down the road we will be able to update SageTV to a newer Google version. We have already been given a time at which this new version will be out and that is within a year, since this is when the EPG update will change.

I have read that GoogleTV was supposed to get the Honeycomb 3.1 update last month, but now it got pushed to late summer. I wonder if the SageTV purchase had anything to do with this. It would be great if the new update had SageTV connectivity or at least an App in the market place.

[wayner]

Originally Posted by jm9843

Bingo. This is why Google TV will succeed and thrive. It's the same model that has worked so well on phones applied to Smart TV's, set-top boxes, receivers, etc. Google said they would be open-sourcing GoogleTV (after the Market becomes available) back when it was announced in May of '10. When that happens CE OEMs, cable/satellite companies, etc. will have to think long and hard about continuing to devote their own time/money/resources developing their own sub-par solution with no supporting ecosystem to speak of. It's a relative no-brainier to adopt the thriving Android platform and bring real value to their customers while incurring far fewer costs than if they go it alone.

But adopting Android is giving up control and cable companies want the control over their hardware. They also do not want to make it easier for their customers to get access to competing services such as Netflix. Think about it - you are a cable company getting about $70/month from customers and selling On Demand movies at $5/movie - do you want to make it easy for them to get Netflix at $8/month. No freakin way!

And I don't think a lot of money is spent developing the UI for cable boxes - the UI for SA/Cisco boxes hasn't materially changed in the 10+ years that I have used these boxes.

This is the only reason that I can think of that Cisco (aka Linksys aka Scientific Atlanta) has not built media streamer techonolgy into its cable boxes.

How hard would it be to take an existing cable box and make it capable of receiving media over your LAN (as well as streaming services like Netflix/Hulu) just like a SageTV extender? You already have a box capable of decoding some video file types (the newer ones can handle MPEG-4 as well as MPEG-2), you have a box with all of the A/V output ports, power supply etc. It should be a piece of cake to graft Sage extender-like technology onto a Cisco/SA cable box but they haven't done it - my guess is because the cable companies would refuse to offer it.

[tvmaster2]

Originally Posted by brainbone

It's easy to set-up your own VPN. When on public networks, I prefer to use my VPN anyway. I've used this to watch Netflix while abroad and it works well. When traveling inside the US, it's not a problem at all (unless you are in a location without enough bandwidth).

where could I find an easy explanation on how to do this? If it's not easy, then it is not an advantage for Netflix. Could/would the average tv viewer be able to do this?
If you have an url to an instruction site that would be great - thanks

[wayner]

There is a site called http://www.unblock-us.com/ that provides a service for using streaming services for non-US based people. They have a free trial and afterwards the product is $5/month. You just change the DNS server addresses on your PC or iPad or router and your are able to use Netflix from anywhere.

[david1234]

Originally Posted by polen

I’m not positive about this, but has Google ever sold hardware to consumers. Phones, tablets and GoogleTV are all made and sold by other companies, so why would they change their MO and sell the HD300 or make a SageTV appliance?

They tried selling their own Google Phone for a little while.

[SHS]

Originally Posted by wayner

There is a site called unblock-us.org that provides a service for using streaming services for non-US based people. They have a free trial and afterwards the product is $5/month. You just change the DNS server addresses on your PC or iPad or router and your are able to use Netflix from anywhere.

When was the last time you check unblock-us.org dead that should be unblock-us.com