SageTV acquired by Google

[robk]

Originally Posted by Ender

As i see it the wiz.bin holds all the viewing habits of ours, and is not google in the information dissemination game so they can sell ads/services?

Is it legal (in the terms and conditions) to sell our private viewing habits to Google? Certainly there is a back door written in SageTV to allow the harvesting of wiz.bin.
On the same subject, has anyone who is knowledgeable in law looked into what SageTV has to keep providing to us, such as Placeshifter Locator ID, EPG, etc.?

[personalt]

Only time will tell what the long term brings... In the short term some of us will sell their sage equipment and move on and some of us will stock up... I think those that never fully got their system working will sell and people like me who finally got things the way they want will try and pick up some extra extenders and wait things out.

I spent a good $2,000 and lots of time to get everyting to work. I have three extenders. I would love to pick up two or three more HD300s

[gabrielcab]

Originally Posted by wayner

Okay, maybe Yahoo is not Google but Yahoo bought Meedio and killed it. Many of us were Meedio users. A lot of the things that made Sage unique don't fit into a large tech company that has to play nice with the media content creators.

With Sage you felt like the product was being developed solely with the best interests of the consumers at heart without regard to DRM, Hollywood, DMCA, etc. I doubt that will be the case with Google.

Don't get into conclusion yet, its too early, this transaction where made a couple of days ago, there must be paperwork still on transit with the postal service. Give a week or two, if no comments are made by then, then it would be an excellent time to panic, but not for now. And remember, Google is not yahoo, or even worst MS, it is Google.

[remmy925]

Well, its at least 6 PCs later....multiple versions later....and I don't regret having purchased SageTV. Over the years I have seen the product mature, cool things happening from the community, and having enjoyed hearing friends complain about their PVR not recording enough shows at once yet mine does 4 at a time and then goes the extra mile without a monthly charge.

Although I hold my breath, I will admit the following and will hold any judgment till I know more
1) Google does a good job of providing services for free
2) Google does a good job of providing services with a sense of polish
3) Google continues to produce services that are relevant to the public

Hopefully this tradition will continue with SageTV without the need to buy special hardware, DRM infection, or loss of the community sharing and innovation which made SageTV such a great product.

I just hope we find some answers soon...if I hold my breath too long, I may not be alive enough to care about my investment in time, money, and loyalty.

[SHS]

My email quote

Yes, this is bad news for all PC based home theater enthusiasts.

It seem that hauppauge which a bit surprise by this to.
Any way I was ask setup a poll stop by make you vote at
http://www.shspvr.com/smf/index.php?topic=12372.0
If you have any you like add thing let me know

[jhughesjr]

I've been using SageTV since 2004 and feel like that highschool quarterback just stole my girlfriend. I'm actually a little surprised it took a company like google this long to figure out what we've all known for years - and that is that SageTV is awesome and "I should buy it" - unfortunately when google thinks "I should buy it" they just buy the whole darn company!

Working for a company that competes with google on a daily basis (who doesn't anymore?) One thing I can say is that they don't tread into these waters lightly - also when they buy a company they buy it for it's technology and how it equates to where they believe the future is headed. They did not buy sage for the user base - they bought it for it's technology and where it can go - they certainly didn't buy it for SageTV 7 - so you have to think - what are they doing behind the scenes that would convince google to do it?

I know everyone has seen the HDHomeRun prime and that it will never work with SageTV - they just aren't big enough and the flexibility it allows will never be allowed by the DRM folks - so we got sage software written in JAVA - easy port to android - so let's say Jeff and crew were able to demo to Google a SageTV skinned media center PC (think the Nook Color) running on Android - they have an end to end solution that could run on Pcs - or set top boxes that would give Sage:
The ability to finally "stop the bleeding" by providing recording of all HDContent - without this ability (HDPVR not included) Sage just could not compete in the future.
Google gets:
An end to end solution - cheaper and better than what Windows can currently offer.
Add to it google's clout and now all of those TVs and blueray players now have built in SageTV plugins that allow you to access your media center just like you would netflix.
Now that to me is a compelling offering that would get me excited.

[gabrielcab]

My only real concern with this transaction is that i bought my 3rd HD300 last week, and i probably will need to change them for the Google HD 400 soon to get the latest.

[drewg]

Wow, this sucks for me in the short term. Just as I was about to move to a bigger house & buy 2 HD300s.. I *hate* PC clients, and even the latest generation XBox360 uses more power than any PC client I'd build. Is the Linksys DMA2100 even comparable to the HD300?

I may just go back to MythTV and PC clients. Sigh.

Thanks,

Drew

[bastafidli]

This thread is awesome judgment about size of Sage community. So many people with few posts on their account coming and saying they used Sage for many, many years... Impressive

[SHS]

Originally Posted by robk

Is it legal (in the terms and conditions) to sell our private viewing habits to Google? Certainly there is a back door written in SageTV to allow the harvesting of wiz.bin.
On the same subject, has anyone who is knowledgeable in law looked into what SageTV has to keep providing to us, such as Placeshifter Locator ID, EPG, etc.?

There nothing wrong with that and would be very useful
Unlike the Nielsen ratings which end killing off a lot real good show.

As for Placeshifter Locator ID that has to do SageTV server but if I'm rigth this where Dynamic DNS service come in that can take care of the problem.

[brainbone]

Originally Posted by gabrielcab

and i probably will need to change them for the Google HD 400 soon

Just like Google did with GoogleTV and Android, I'm guessing Google will rely on third party manufactures to build and sell a variety of GoogleTV compatible PVR appliances. I'll also guess that existing GoogleTV systems, and probably most recent Android phones, will work with whatever is produced...

... but then I could be reading the tea leaves all wrong ...

[Brent]

I've posed a long list of questions to Google PR folks. Doubt I'll get many of those answered - at first anyway. But I do hope to get some of them answered.

My hope is that Jeff negotiated at least something for existing SageTV users to:
1. continue to receive EPG data for a while - the longer the better
2. update SageTV to a release version - it's last update is currently in a final beta version
3. Some DVR-centric future.

I'm very unsure of what Google will do with the SageTV properties. I hope DVR with tuners is part of the equation and I hope it includes software-only versions. I also hope for the 3rd part stuff to work with whatever comes of this. But I'm very pessimistic because I know Google has much different goals and is so big that it can't risk being as "open" as SageTV was. I'm in a wait-and-see mode at the moment but like most of you looking at my limited options if I have to move on.

[photon]

What they did by summarily closing the store is kill Sage TV with one blow of a fly swatter. No transition period. No chance to finish building out. No chance to upgrade or replace an ailing out of warranty unit. If you were snoozing you lost.

Reading the press and the announcement I think this might be great from the perspective of Google and for the wonderful Sage TV developers but I don't see anything positive for Sage TV fans. I have no hope for the future of anything like the sage TV we have known. Whatever comes from this will be a long way down the road with nothing like it to fill the gap in the mean time.

Send in the Grief counselors.

[panteragstk]

Originally Posted by bastafidli

This thread is awesome judgment about size of Sage community. So many people with few posts on their account coming and saying they used Sage for many, many years... Impressive

I was thinking the same thing. We have often wondered how many sage users there actually are. I guess we have a better idea now.

[Sanguine]

Interesting article on GigaOM essentially saying that Google has no interest in the DVR functionality of SageTV. Media playback capabilities and the programming guide aren't anything Google couldn't have put together quickly. They say it's all about the Placeshifter and integrating Slingbox-like capability for Android devices.

http://gigaom.com/video/google-sagetv-acquisition/

* merged *

[tvmaster2]

Originally Posted by SHS

There nothing wrong with that and would be very useful
Unlike the Nielsen ratings which end killing off a lot real good show.

As for Placeshifter Locator ID that has to do SageTV server but if I'm rigth this where Dynamic DNS service come in that can take care of the problem.

Actually, in Canada at least, the thing that delayed Tivos' release in Canada was the fact that it violated Canadian privacy laws I believe.
Isn't that interesting. The idea that the unit was reporting back without an OK from the user is NOT AOK in Canada.

As far as the EPG data - didn't we enter a contract with SageTV LLC when we paid for our license to receive said data? Wouldn't the company have to go bankrupt for that contract to be broken?

[photon]

Originally Posted by Brent

I've posed a long list of questions to Google PR folks. Doubt I'll get many of those answered - at first anyway. But I do hope to get some of them answered.

My hope is that Jeff negotiated at least something for existing SageTV users to:
1. continue to receive EPG data for a while - the longer the better

Thanks for doing that. I hope they are responsive.

EPG data is critical isn't it?. Without it they brick the entire installed user base don't they?

[Brent]

Originally Posted by tvmaster2

As far as the EPG data - didn't we enter a contract with SageTV LLC when we paid for our license to receive said data? Wouldn't the company have to go bankrupt for that contract to be broken?

Nope. The contract said nothing about any guarantee of how long we as users receive EPG data. It was about how that data could be used when we did receive it.

[brainbone]

Originally Posted by Sanguine

Interesting article on GigaOM essentially saying that Google has no interest in the DVR functionality of SageTV. Media playback capabilities and the programming guide aren't anything Google couldn't have put together quickly. They say it's all about the Placeshifter and integrating Slingbox-like capability for Android devices.

http://gigaom.com/video/google-sagetv-acquisition/

That's ridiculous. What is Google place-shifting? From where? If from Google's servers, I think they already have plenty of IP that can take care of that. If from a consumer's home, then they are targeting home media, and at that point you're talking about some kind of appliance... and if you now have an in-home appliance for processing video, and you have interest in DVR for another one of your offerings, why wouldn't you add DVR capabilities to that appliance?

[whurlston]

First, let me say congratulations to the SageTV team. I would like to curse you and say vile things but that would be pure jealousy talking.

Please allow a perspective from a non SageTV user (some of you know me as vladd on AVS).

SageTV users are nowhere near as bad off with this announcement as some of you believe. Lets assume the worst for a moment and say that Google kills off SageTV as Yahoo did with Meedios. You still have a good working piece of software that is capable of lasting for a very long time. Your only real issues are:

1. EPG data feeds ceasing.
2. Hardware failing in the case of extenders.
3. Inability to purchase new extenders or PC client licenses.

Now lets look at those:

In the case of EPG data, there are several alternatives that produce XMLTV data that can easily be used. Side note: I know that SHS mentioned Schedules Direct but I should warn you that you would be violating the Schedules Direct TOS since SageTV is not a free or open source software. Given the userbase, you may end up forcing TMS to revoke their agreement with Schedules Direct which would not do the HTPC community any good.

In the case of extender/PC clients. Not much you can do there in regards to SageTV but lets look at alternatives. SHS has some good options in his poll. You guys have some very talented third party developers that would be wonderful additions to any of those communities. It would almost be trivial to add a SageTV community touch to some of those projects. I'll discuss the one with which I am most familiar as an example.

NextPVR (GB-PVR) uses PCH NMTs for extenders (similar to your extenders) and can also use PC clients. Although the main software is closed source, it has a very extensive plugin structure (sound familiar?). I'm sure that MVallevand who does the main development for the PCH extenders would welcome help from developers interested in working with the extenders. It would probably even be possible to create a port to use your existing extenders with NextPVR.

For other functionality, I'm already working on DCT support for NextPVR and I'm willing to work with anyone who owns an R5000-HD (MKANET) to add support for it. It should be quite possible, I'm just not in the position to purchase one myself.

Most of the other options (like MediaPortal) are open source and any of your developers could contribute code to add the functionality/features that you want.

You guys are in a much better position that you realize, especially with the size of your userbase.