The instructions sound fine, but don't work.

[pjpjpjpj]

First off, I am using an HD Homerun and therefore (as of the last update) I do my channel scans directly in SageTV, without scanning in the HDHR software.

I have four channels in my (Cincinnati, OH) EPG lineup that are giving me problems.

25-1 WOTHLD [47-25-1] "WOTHLD"
25-2 WKRPTV [47-25-2] "WKRPTV" (yes, it's WKRP in Cincinnati!)
25-3 WBQCTV [47-25-3] "WBQCTV"
25-4 SKYLINE [47-25-4] "SKYLINE"

However, when I go to Zap2It.com, they are listed as:
25-1 WOTHLD
25-2 WOTHLD2
25-3 WOTHLD3
25-4 WOTHLD4

Now the confusion. I am not getting program listings for -1, -2, and -3 ("No data"). I would think 25-1 would get data, since the name matches up.

BUT... somehow, I do get listings for 25-4, even though the website says "WOTHLD4" and Sage says "SKYLINE". I am guessing that the channel number code (which you can not see from the channel setup... and why not??) must match on only this channel.

So you would think I could just manually enter the other channels... add a new channel at 47-25-2, call it "WOTHLD2", and give it the channel code from Z2I (62832). NOPE. It doesn't work. The channel shows up in the EPG, but gets "No data" as well.

I guess my biggest question is, where does SageTV get the names that it affiliates with each channel when you do a channel scan (specifically now that you don't use the HDHR software to scan first)? Does this come through the air? Is this programmed into the SageTV software database when you enter your OTA city in the tuner setup wizard? Can this be manually edited? Do I need to contact Sage to get this corrected?

And another, somewhat-unrelated odd thing... my local ABC affiliate, on the Z2I website, is listing the Lakers/Magic game (not happening because the series ended the other night), but the Sage EPG is correct (with the re-run sitcoms they are playing instead). How in the world is Sage correct and the website showing the wrong thing? Or, more specifically, how are they different at all?

[Opus4]

After a quick read, it isn't clear to me whether you've remapped the stations for your channels, so just in case, see p. 164 of the v6.5 SageTV PDF manual for the section titled "Remapping Stations for EPG data using ATSC or QAM Digital Tuners".

If the stations are not mapped correctly, you can sometimes get EPG data for a the next few days via the broadcast stream.

If the stations are mapped correctly, you can sometimes end up with no EPG data for an OTA channel in SageTV if the station is OTA-only. If this is the case, it might be better to map to a non-Zap2it station so it can try to get EPG data from the stream.

- Andy

[pjpjpjpj]

Thanks, Andy.

I haven't done any remapping. The names I listed at the top of my post ("SKYLINE", etc.) are what showed up in my EPG when I did a channel scan. I guess what I want to know is, what gives the channels those names when you do a scan? SageTV's software (by choosing your city lineup)? Or data that comes through the air?

I don't know how I would remap to get the stations to be "WOTHLD2", "WOTHLD3", "WOTHLD4". There is no remap option to assign a different name, nor to assign a different Zap2It station code. The stations I have showing already have correct physical and logical channel numbers ([47-25-x]). I tried creating new channels from scratch (with the station ID code and names matching Z2I) and it gives me "No data".

How do I get data from the broadcast stream? Could that be why "SKYLINE" is showing EPG data and none of the others?

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by pjpjpjpj

I haven't done any remapping. The names I listed at the top of my post ("SKYLINE", etc.) are what showed up in my EPG when I did a channel scan. I guess what I want to know is, what gives the channels those names when you do a scan? SageTV's software (by choosing your city lineup)? Or data that comes through the air?

The ATSC stream will often contain a station name, but that often won't be the same as the one from Zap2it.

I don't know how I would remap to get the stations to be "WOTHLD2", "WOTHLD3", "WOTHLD4". There is no remap option to assign a different name, nor to assign a different Zap2It station code. The stations I have showing already have correct physical and logical channel numbers ([47-25-x]).

Are you asking how to remap or are you saying the stations aren't available for remapping? If you are asking how, then see the manual reference I posted above. If you mean the station name isn't part of the OTA lineup in SageTV, then odds are its EPG Data isn't available for SageTV from Zap2it.

I tried creating new channels from scratch (with the station ID code and names matching Z2I) and it gives me "No data".

That would indicate to me that they are OTA-only.

How do I get data from the broadcast stream? Could that be why "SKYLINE" is showing EPG data and none of the others?

Yes, that would be why that channel shows some EPG data -- if you look at the details for an airing on that channel, its show ID will probably start with DT.

- Andy

[pjpjpjpj]

All of these channels I speak of are OTA-only. Is that the issue?

On Z2I, all four channels are all listed and scheduled (per my first post above). They have a names and station IDs (see one example in my first post, for "WOTHLD2").

But when I scan for channels in SageTV, the names that the channels get assigned - "SKYLINE", etc. - are different from what Z2I is calling them.

Here's what I want to really know - what is the key that makes the EPG data match up with what SageTV pulls from Z2I? The station ID? The station physical/logical numbers (i.e., [47-25-1])? Or the station name? Or any of these?

It sounds like, from your last post, that the names that are assigned in the SageTV channel lineup come through the air from the ATSC streams. Is this the case (you didn't clearly say, you answered my question with a question)? And if they were changed (manually by editing the .frq file?), would that change anything?

I am still confused why the station that I added, which had physical number, logical number, name, and ID, all matching Zap2It, did not work. What more could I possibly do?

Perhaps what I am missing is that the data that SageTV pulls from Zap2It is not the same data that Zap2It posts on their website??

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by pjpjpjpj

All of these channels I speak of are OTA-only. Is that the issue?

That's what I said above; here's a FAQ about it:

Some of my channels have no Program Guide data, but other channels do and their data is getting updated. Why do some channels have no data?

- Andy

[vikingisson]

I'm a bit confused now too. My OTA stations that aren't getting accurate or sometimes no EPG data are all Canadian stations. The Buffalo area stations have data but the Canadian stations seem to only get data from the stream if I watch the channel for a while.

Using the latest beta release the remapping is a bit different than the manual. Is "Remap Station" the same as " Remap -> Map Different Station to this Physical Channel"? If I map it to the sat version of the same channel it works but it also replaces the sat station and places it way down the list in the 200s instead of the low number where I want it. The Logical Chan number setting doesn't make any difference to where it appears.

Again, this is only for the Canadian stations. The call sign and logos are right.

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by vikingisson

Using the latest beta release the remapping is a bit different than the manual. Is "Remap Station" the same as " Remap -> Map Different Station to this Physical Channel"?

Yes, the station remapping concept is the same; the user just does it differently in the latest beta.

If I map it to the sat version of the same channel it works but it also replaces the sat station and places it way down the list in the 200s instead of the low number where I want it. The Logical Chan number setting doesn't make any difference to where it appears.

See pages 47 and/or 149 in the PDF manual - the same channels on multiple lineups are merged in the guide.

- Andy

[vikingisson]

ok, then I am doing it right. I would however prefer to see the channel in the normal spot instead of buried deep in the sat listings. I like seeing the OTA channels grouped together at the top since I'll always prefer OTA if the desired show is available.
Bottom line is that Canadian EPG for OTA channels doesn't work very well.

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by vikingisson

I would however prefer to see the channel in the normal spot instead of buried deep in the sat listings. I like seeing the OTA channels grouped together at the top since I'll always prefer OTA if the desired show is available.

Then remap the logical (guide) number for the channel(s) to whatever you prefer on all other lineups where the channel is enabled.

- Andy

[pjpjpjpj]

Originally Posted by Opus4

That's what I said above; here's a FAQ about it:
- Andy

From that FAQ:

The guide data for OTA broadcast stations that are not also part of a cable or satellite lineup from Zap2it is not available to SageTV.

Good enough, but I am now curious - why? Is that some contractual/legal thing, or do the Sage programmers not deem OTA-only people "worthy of bothering"?

If Z2I has EPG info in their listings for OTA, why doesn't/can't Sage get it?

(I realize, Andy, that you may not know the answer to this, so if you don't, just say "I don't know". I'm just venting.)

[vikingisson]

Originally Posted by Opus4

Then remap the logical (guide) number for the channel(s) to whatever you prefer on all other lineups where the channel is enabled.

- Andy

That's my point, it doesn't seem to work that way anymore. ex: I set CBLT-DT 5-1 OTA to CBLT 210 (Sat). The logical number remains at 5-1 but I only see the channel under the #210 position. I even tried manually setting the logical to 5-1, nothing appeared to change and I only see the channel in the 210 position.

Oh wait, here's something; if I disable the sat channel such as CBLT 210 from the HD-PVR source then the remapped OTA channels show up in the right place and have guide info. If I renable the sat channels then the remapped OTA channels go away again.

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by pjpjpjpj

Good enough, but I am now curious - why? Is that some contractual/legal thing, or do the Sage programmers not deem OTA-only people "worthy of bothering"?

If Z2I has EPG info in their listings for OTA, why doesn't/can't Sage get it?

SageTV pays Zap2it for the EPG data you receive as part of the SageTV app & OTA-only channels just aren't part of the agreement with Zap2it.

Originally Posted by vikingisson

That's my point, it doesn't seem to work that way anymore. ex: I set CBLT-DT 5-1 OTA to CBLT 210 (Sat). The logical number remains at 5-1 but I only see the channel under the #210 position. I even tried manually setting the logical to 5-1, nothing appeared to change and I only see the channel in the 210 position.

Oh wait, here's something; if I disable the sat channel such as CBLT 210 from the HD-PVR source then the remapped OTA channels show up in the right place and have guide info. If I renable the sat channels then the remapped OTA channels go away again.

Please re-read what I posted above about remapping on the other lineups, because it sounds like you didn't try what I suggested:

Originally Posted by Opus4

Then remap the logical (guide) number for the channel(s) to whatever you prefer on all other lineups where the channel is enabled.

- Andy

[vikingisson]

Originally Posted by Opus4

SageTV pays Zap2it for the EPG data you receive as part of the SageTV app & OTA-only channels just aren't part of the agreement with Zap2it.


Please re-read what I posted above about remapping on the other lineups, because it sounds like you didn't try what I suggested:


- Andy

Did that too, still not right. It works fine if I disable the sat channel dupes of the remapped OTA channels. I don't need the sat version anyway, happier with the OTA. thanks

btw, these channels are not OTA only. But they are Canadian so I can understand that we're 3rd world status. The NY OTA channels have good EPG.

[pjpjpjpj]

Originally Posted by Opus4

SageTV pays Zap2it for the EPG data you receive as part of the SageTV app & OTA-only channels just aren't part of the agreement with Zap2it.

I just learned that DirecTV added those four stations (well, one station with three subchannels) to their lineup here. Apparently this happened just last evening. So, presumably, I will be able to get these EPG listings.

Does Sage need to do something on their end (to the local OTA listing data for my city) to match up to the Zap2It data, now that Z2I has added these channels? Or does it all work out automatically? Do I need to contact Sage support?

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by pjpjpjpj

I just learned that DirecTV added those four stations (well, one station with three subchannels) to their lineup here. Apparently this happened just last evening. So, presumably, I will be able to get these EPG listings.

Does Sage need to do something on their end (to the local OTA listing data for my city) to match up to the Zap2It data, now that Z2I has added these channels? Or does it all work out automatically? Do I need to contact Sage support?

I would think it would be automatic, but I have no idea how quickly the Zap2it lineups get updated for those changes. I would give it a few days & if it doesn't change, then use the contact link in the FAQ I posted above.

- Andy

[pjpjpjpj]

Originally Posted by Opus4

I would think it would be automatic, but I have no idea how quickly the Zap2it lineups get updated for those changes. I would give it a few days & if it doesn't change, then use the contact link in the FAQ I posted above.

- Andy

As always, thanks for you patience and your help, Andy!