Getting DVB-C to work

[thborchert]

Hi,

I am desperately trying to get SageTV 6 to work with German DVB-C with a FireDTV box. The tuning just won't work, and I have the feeling I know too little about the format of the .frq file and the whole process. Can someone help me please? Here is the situation:

1. I can scan and tune channels with Anders Nolbergers SBDARecorder.
2. The xml-file generated by SBDARecorder gives one channel info as this:

- <channel>
<channelNo>-1</channelNo>
<programName>Das Erste</programName>
<programID>28106</programID>
<frequency>113000</frequency>
<symbolRate>6900</symbolRate>
<modulationType>3</modulationType>
<videoPid>101</videoPid>
<audioPid>102</audioPid>
<ac3Pid>106</ac3Pid>
<encrypted>false</encrypted>
<serviceType>1</serviceType>
- <videoPids>
- <videoPid>
<pid>101</pid>
<streamType>2</streamType>
<language />
</videoPid>
</videoPids>
- <audioPids>
- <audioPid>
<pid>102</pid>
<streamType>4</streamType>
<language>deu</language>
</audioPid>
</audioPids>
- <ac3Pids>
- <ac3Pid>
<pid>106</pid>
<streamType>256</streamType>
<language>deu</language>
</ac3Pid>
</ac3Pids>
</channel>

3. However, if I understand the feature list of SgaeTV 6 correctly, I shouldn't need to go through SBDARecorder, Sage should be able to handle DVB-C directly.

4. This is one of the few lists of channel info I found for my cable provider (Kabel Deutschland): http://www.edi-hof.de/cable/cable-index.html

5. This is what I put in the .frq file - but I have no idea what permitted values for "moduration" (typo?) or the other entries are.

#DVBT channel setup table ver 2.1, country:Germanyloaded predefined freq table: 0 channel freqtotal_channel:200
#ch:index onid tsid program_id freq symbol_rate moduration ctrl_bits(1:enable; 0:disable)
ch:1 1 1101 28106 113000 6900 3 1 #
ch:2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 #

What can I do?

Thanks!

Thomas

[rickgillyon]

Originally Posted by thborchert

5. This is what I put in the .frq file - but I have no idea what permitted values for "moduration" (typo?) or the other entries are.

For scanning to work you'd need a PreDefinedScanCable.frq file, but I've no real idea what would go in it for Germany. Current one:

#DVB-C setup:  (frequnecy, symbol_rate)+modualtion
#DVB-C setup:  (frequnecy, symbol_rate)+modualtion
#modualtion 16QAM:1,32QAM:2,64QAM:3,80QAM:4,96QAM:5,112QAM:6,128QAM:7,160QAM:8,192QAM:9,224QAM:10,256QAM:11,320QAM:12,
#384QAM:13,448QAM:14,512QAM:15,640QAM:16,768QAM:17,896QAM:18,1024QAM:19,QPSK:20,BPSK:21,OQPSK:22,8VSB:23,16VSB:24,

"United States of America","Canada"=[
[(55250000,6),(61250000,6),(67250000,6),(73250000,6),(77250000,6), 
(83250000,6),(175250000,6),(181250000,6),(187250000,6),(193250000,6),
(199250000,6),(205250000,6),(211250000,6),(121262500,6),(127262500,6), 
(133262500,6),(139250000,6),(145250000,6),(151250000,6),(157250000,6), 
(163250000,6),(169250000,6),(217250000,6),(223250000,6),(229262500,6), 
(235262500,6),(241262500,6),(247262500,6),(253262500,6),(259262500,6), 
(265262500,6),(271262500,6),(277262500,6),(283262500,6),(289262500,6), 
(295262500,6),(301262500,6),(307262500,6),(313262500,6),(319262500,6),  
(325262500,6),(331275000,6),(337262500,6),(343262500,6),(349262500,6),  
(355262500,6),(361262500,6),(367262500,6),(373262500,6),(379262500,6), 
(385262500,6),(391262500,6),(397262500,6),(403250000,6),(409250000,6),  
(415250000,6),(421250000,6),(427250000,6),(433250000,6),(439250000,6),  
(445250000,6),(451250000,6),(457250000,6),(463250000,6),(469250000,6),  
(475250000,6),(481250000,6),(487250000,6),(493250000,6),(499250000,6),  
(505250000,6),(511250000,6),(517250000,6),(523250000,6),(529250000,6),  
(535250000,6),(541250000,6),(547250000,6),(553250000,6),(559250000,6),  
(565250000,6),(571250000,6),(577250000,6),(583250000,6),(589250000,6),  
(595250000,6),(601250000,6),(607250000,6),(613250000,6),(619250000,6),  
(625250000,6),(631250000,6),(637250000,6),(643250000,6),(9150000 ,6),  
(9750000 ,6), (103250000,6),(109275000,6),(115275000,6),(649250000,6),
(655250000,6),(661250000,6),(667250000,6),(673250000,6),(679250000,6),                      
(685250000,6),(691250000,6),(697250000,6),(703250000,6),(709250000,6), 
(715250000,6),(721250000,6),(727250000,6),(733250000,6),(739250000,6), 
(745250000,6),(751250000,6),(757250000,6),(763250000,6),(769250000,6), 
(775250000,6),(781250000,6),(787250000,6),(793250000,6),(799250000,6), 
(805250000,6),(811250000,6),(817250000,6),(823250000,6),(829250000,6), 
(835250000,6),(841250000,6),(847250000,6),(853250000,6),(859250000,6), 
(865250000,6),(871250000,6),(877250000,6),(883250000,6),(889250000,6), 
(895250000,6),(901250000,6),(907250000,6),(913250000,6),(919250000,6),
(925250000,6),(931250000,6),(937250000,6),(943250000,6),(949250000,6),
(955250000,6),(961250000,6),(967250000,6),(973250000,6),(979250000,6),
(985250000,6),(991250000,6),(997250000,6),(1003250000,6)];

"Denmark"=[(50500,6875)+3,(57500,6875)+3,(64500,6875)+3,(71500,6875)+3,
	(78500,6875)+3,(85500,6875)+3,(92500,6875)+3,(99500,6875)+3,(107500,6875)+3,
	(114500,6875)+3,(121500,6875)+3,(128500,6875)+3,(135500,6875)+3,(142000,6875)+3,
	(143000,6875)+3,(156500,6875)+3,(163500,6875)+3,(170500,6875)+3,(177500,6875)+3,
	(184500,6875)+3,(191500,6875)+3,(198500,6875)+3,(205500,6875)+3,(212500,6875)+3,
	(219500,6875)+3,(226500,6875)+3,(233500,6875)+3,(240500,6875)+3,(247500,6875)+3,
	(254500,6875)+3,(261500,6875)+3,(268500,6875)+3,(275500,6875)+3,(282500,6875)+3,
	(289500,6875)+3,(296500,6875)+3,(306000,6875)+3,(314000,6875)+3,(322000,6875)+3,
	(330000,6875)+3,(338000,6875)+3,(346000,6875)+3,(354000,6875)+3,(362000,6875)+3,
	(370000,6875)+3,(378000,6875)+3,(386000,6875)+3,(394000,6875)+3,(402000,6875)+3,
	(410000,6875)+3,(418000,6875)+3,(426000,6875)+3,(434000,6875)+3,(442000,6875)+3,
	(450000,6875)+3,(458000,6875)+3,(466000,6875)+3,(474000,6875)+3,(482000,6875)+3,
	(490000,6875)+3,(498000,6875)+3,(506000,6875)+3,(514000,6875)+3,(522000,6875)+3,
	(530000,6875)+3,(538000,6875)+3,(546000,6875)+3,(554000,6875)+3,(562000,6875)+3,
	(570000,6875)+3,(578000,6875)+3,(586000,6875)+3,(594000,6875)+3,(602000,6875)+3,
	(610000,6875)+3,(618000,6875)+3,(626000,6875)+3,(634000,6875)+3,(642000,6875)+3,
	(650000,6875)+3,(658000,6875)+3,(666000,6875)+3,(674000,6875)+3,(682000,6875)+3,
	(690000,6875)+3,(698000,6875)+3,(706000,6875)+3,(714000,6875)+3,(722000,6875)+3,
	(730000,6875)+3,(738000,6875)+3,(746000,6875)+3,(754000,6875)+3,(762000,6875)+3,
	(770000,6875)+3,(778000,6875)+3,(786000,6875)+3,(794000,6875)+3,(802000,6875)+3,
	(810000,6875)+3,(818000,6875)+3,(826000,6875)+3,(834000,6875)+3,(842000,6875)+3,
	(850000,6875)+3,(858000,6875)+3,((274000,6900)+7,(282000,6900)+7,(162000,6900)+3,
	(170000,6900)+7,{}]


"Finland-HTV"=[(274000,6900)+7,(282000,6900)+7,(162000,6900)+3,(170000,6900)+7,
	(290000,6900)+7,(146000,6900)+7,(154000,6900)+7,(138000,6900)+7,(266000,6900)+7,
	(362000,6900)+7,(298000,6900)+7,(354000,6900)+7,(370000,6900)+7,(378000,6900)+7,
	(394000,6900)+7,(386000,6900)+7,(258000,6900)+7,(250000,6900)+7,(314000,6900)+7,
	(306000,6900)+3,(322000,6900)+7,{}]

"Netherlands-Casema"=[(340000,6875)+3,(348000,6875)+3,(356000,6875)+3,(364000,6875)+3,
	(372000,6875)+3,(380000,6875)+3,(388000,6875)+3,(396000,6875)+3,(404000,6875)+3,
	(412000,6875)+3,(420000,6875)+3,(428000,6875)+3,(436000,6875)+3,(444000,6875)+3,
	(324000,6875)+3,(332000,6875)+3,(452000,6875)+3,(460000,6875)+3,{}]
"Netherlands-TVHome"=[(255000,6875)+3,(247000,6875)+3,(263000,6875)+3,(271000,6875)+3,
	(279000,6875)+3,(287000,6875)+3,(295000,6875)+3,(305000,6875)+3,(313000,6875)+3,
	(321000,6875)+3,(329000,6875)+3,(337000,6875)+3,(345000,6875)+3,(353000,6875)+3,
	(361000,6875)+3,(369000,6875)+3,(610000,6875)+3,(618000,6875)+3,(762000,6875)+3,
	(810000,6875)+3,(818000,6875)+3,{}]

"Norway-CanalDigital"=[(306000,6950)+3,(314000,6950)+3,(322000,6950)+3,(346000,6950)+3,
	(354000,6950)+3,(362000,6950)+3,(370000,6950)+3,(378000,6950)+3,(386000,6950)+3,
	(394000,6950)+3,(402000,6950)+3,(410000,6950)+3,(418000,6950)+3,(426000,6950)+3,
	(434000,6950)+3,(442000,6950)+3,(450000,6950)+3,(458000,6950)+3,{}]

"Sweden-ComHem"=[(290000,6875)+3,(298000,6875)+3,(306000,6875)+3,(314000,6875)+3,
	(322000,6875)+3,(338000,6875)+3,(346000,6875)+3,(354000,6875)+3,(362000,6875)+3,
	(370000,6875)+3,(378000,6875)+3,(386000,6875)+3,(394000,6875)+3,(402000,6875)+3,
	(418000,6875)+3,(714000,6875)+3,(722000,6875)+3,(738000,6875)+3,{}]

So looks like you need to add Germany with groups of frequencies, e.g.
"Germany"=[(113000,6900)+3,(115000,6900)+3,{}]

There's a good chance you're on 64QAM, so modulation is 3, but Modulation values are at the top of the PreDefinedScanCable.frq file. Slap the first value in that file and try scanning for channels within Sage again!

[thborchert]

That looks good, thanks a bunch. Some frequencies are on QAM256, and those have a different symbol rate, too, but I can change that.

However, I am not quite clear how scanning works in relation to the EPG data. Does it scan only for channels mentioned in the EPG? Or all given in the predefined list?

One more thing: There are several providers in Germany, so it would make sense to call it "Germany-KDG" from the start. Where in the process of setting up a new video source do I select that item from the predefined scanning file?

Thanks again!

Thomas

[rickgillyon]

When you first add the tuner it will ask for region, or you can set it in the Video Source properties (alongside channels etc).

What sort of EPG source do you have? What I would do is scan, get a <tuner name>.frq file from the scanning. Remove the source and re-add without tuning (make sure you back up the FRQ just in case) and assign the lineup. Then edit the frq so that the Ch:n numbers match the numbers of your EPG, or just map EPG channels in channel setup to the physical FRQ channels.

[thborchert]

Ok, that worked like a charm. Thanks for your help!

Thomas

[thborchert]

Well, I spoke too soon. Sage now does scan the channels alright. And it shows unencrypted channels without a problem. But it doesn't work with encrypted channels. However, these channels do show in MyTheatre and SBDARecorder. Sage seems to not work well with the BDA drivers.

Thomas

[rickgillyon]

So you have a card and cam in the FireDTV? You should raise a bug report, I'm sure Sage will want to work it through with you...

[thborchert]

Did already. Yes, card and CAM in there - and the encrypted channels (marked red in SBDARecorder) work there in Preview mode, but not in Sage.

One more thing, since you seem to be very familiar with SBDARec: Some of the "red" channels" will show perfectly fine in SBDARec preview, some will show with a "mosaicized" video comprised of a wild mix of small snippets from the true picture. Any idea what could cause this?

Thanks!

Thomas

[thborchert]

Oh, and one more thing: Do you know if TSStream as mux will work with SBDARec and SageTV 6?

T.

[rickgillyon]

Sorry, haven't used SBDAR since DVB-T was incorporated into Sage.

Preview and normal watching are separate methods AFAIR, preview never works with plugins like MyTheatre. I've seen before where channels would preview fine but not tune (in early DVBT development). Hopefully Sage can help with that one.

[thborchert]

Here's the word from Sage support:

"We currently don't support encrypted channels, but I will forward this to the developers to look into."

That makes SBDARecorder more appealing than ever.

Thomas

[hornsounder]

Hi,

i have an firedtv dvb-c device with alphacrypt light and german ish cable provider and got it to work native with showing encrypted channels. There are a lot of other problems, but i havent any problems with encrypted channels. i opened a ticket and support is hopefully working on it, but they didnt mntioned to me that encrypted channels are not supported.

The problems i encountered are:

-scanning crashes sage tv service under many circumstances
if i put the channel manually in the frq file it works.

-channel switching is not reliable, sometimes it needs 2 or 3 tries to get a lock.

-digital music channels appear in the channel list but are not working (the shouldnt show up then)

-the channel names were sometimes wired


greetings

Alexander

[Alfiegerner]

Originally Posted by thborchert

Here's the word from Sage support:

"We currently don't support encrypted channels, but I will forward this to the developers to look into."

That makes SBDARecorder more appealing than ever.

Thomas

Your other option is to use the my theatre plugin.

[Alfiegerner]

Originally Posted by hornsounder

Hi,

i have an firedtv dvb-c device with alphacrypt light and german ish cable provider and got it to work native with showing encrypted channels. There are a lot of other problems, but i havent any problems with encrypted channels. i opened a ticket and support is hopefully working on it, but they didnt mntioned to me that encrypted channels are not supported.

The problems i encountered are:

-scanning crashes sage tv service under many circumstances
if i put the channel manually in the frq file it works.

-channel switching is not reliable, sometimes it needs 2 or 3 tries to get a lock.

-digital music channels appear in the channel list but are not working (the shouldnt show up then)

-the channel names were sometimes wired


greetings

Alexander

I believe that these are issues for many people with the built in DVB support generally. I know I have some of these problems using a dvb-t card - particularly annoying is that cahnnel switching is not reliable. I know that some people say that eventually the tuning 'beds in' although I haven't found that.

[thborchert]

I have all those problems, too. The funny thing is: if you look at the huge thread on SBDARec, you'll find that SBDARec went through all those problems in earlier versions of the software, too. They seem to have been solved, though.

Thomas

[thborchert]

Originally Posted by Alfiegerner

Your other option is to use the my theatre plugin.

So what are the main differences between SBDAR and that plugin - apart from the cost for MyTheatre?

Thomas

[Alfiegerner]

I was thinking about your problem with scrambled channels. I don't know if you're still getting the issue with mosiacised pictures but you might find my theatre renders these channels correctly.

[rickgillyon]

Originally Posted by thborchert

Here's the word from Sage support:

"We currently don't support encrypted channels, but I will forward this to the developers to look into."

That makes SBDARecorder more appealing than ever.

As DVB-S is still in development, I guess DVB-C will follow. If it's passed to a dev, then there's a chance they will contact you for further testing. Fingers crossed.

[rickgillyon]

Originally Posted by Alfiegerner

I believe that these are issues for many people with the built in DVB support generally. I know I have some of these problems using a dvb-t card - particularly annoying is that cahnnel switching is not reliable.

It's hard to say what the percentages are with problems. DVB-T has been rock-solid for me for ages on the Cinergy cards (.255 driver).

[rickgillyon]

Originally Posted by thborchert

So what are the main differences between SBDAR and that plugin - apart from the cost for MyTheatre?

MyTheatre uses DVBCore plugins, which can add all manner of extra functionality. Browse the MyTheatre forums for details.