Component output...video too large

[garyellis]

Component output..video too large...

I finally found an hour or 2 to try Component video with my HTTP and Sage..I have been using S-video for the last 6 months...

at higher resolution my TV forces component input to 16 X 9 and I have a 4 X 3 screen...At the 480 resolution, the video is very large, including the UI for Sage. Maybe 3 or 4 times as large as my screen...Does this make sense? and how do I make it the right size in 4 x 3 screen?

Thanks,

Gary

[garyellis]

Please somebody help...

no answers, yet....

Thanks, Gary Ellis

[dagar]

Sounds like it belongs in 'hardware'.

We need some info:
1. TV Model
2. Video Card
3. Vid Card driver version
4. OS rev
5. What resolution you are trying to run out the component ports

[garyellis]

1. TV Model

Sony flat screen HD ready 4 x 3 ...any resolution greater than 480 and the TV seems to force the video to 16 x 9..

2. Video Card

Nvidia GeForce 6200 Turbo charge

3. Vid Card driver version

driver version 7.7.7.7

4. OS rev

Windows XP SP2

5. What resolution you are trying to run out the component ports

I would love to run 1024 with 4 x 3 video, but when I do, it comes through at 16 x 9..So, 480, may be as high as I can go and get 4 x 3.


Also, I run the monitor out on multiview or N view...if that matters...

Thanks,

Gary Ellis

[gplasky]

Check your TV menus and see if you can force it all to 4:3. It may be the TV when it senses a higher res signal switching it to 16:9 mode. If you can force it then you should be good with the higher res.

Gerry

[GKusnick]

My guess is that this is not a TV issue but a video driver issue. First thing I'd suggest is to use up-to-date drivers. 77.77 is pretty old. The current Nvidia driver release is 91.47.

Next, set your desktop res to something the TV can support and see if you can get it working in Clone mode. If SageTV is all you use this PC for, you might consider just leaving it in Clone mode, or setting the TV to be your primary monitor.

If after doing that you can see the whole Windows desktop, but the SageTV window is still too big, just resize the window or go to full-screen mode.

[MoopZilla]

Try changing the overscan settings in the Nvidia drivers. This was happening on my tv, there should be 2 sliders you can change.

[mike1961]

I can help you easily with this one. I had the EXACT SAME problem as you. Here's the answer:

1. Forget about Sage for the moment. Concentrate only on making it right with at the windows desktop where you see all the icons. First get that right so that the windows desktop covers the entire screen.

2. Why in the world are you using Component Video on a 4x3 monitor? Switch to VGA (provided that your monitor has that input and most HDTV's do). Then set to the resolution you want such as 1024x768 and then restart the computer (not sage, the computer).

3. If you insist on using component video, try 1024x768 and then restart the computer. But, it still may not work and you may have to mess around with different resolutions to get as good a fit as possible. Best solution is to go VGA because it's going to look a lot more clear anyway.

4. Once the problem is corrected so that you see the entire windows desktop on your HDTV - go into Sage and adjust overscan settings as needed. Next, if you need to you can tell Sage (via the Options menu) to use either 4x3, 16x9, Source or Fill).

Mike

[garyellis]

Mike thanks for the response and thanks for trying...however,

1. Forget about Sage for the moment. Concentrate only on making it right with at the windows desktop where you see all the icons. First get that right so that the windows desktop covers the entire screen.

when I use component input to the TV, I get a desktop in 16x9 at 1028 resolution and a very large desktop at 480 TV out resolution. Try as I might, I can't get the 1028 to be anything other than 16x9 (the desktop is 1028 and the TV out resolution is 1028.)

2. Why in the world are you using Component Video on a 4x3 monitor? Switch to VGA (provided that your monitor has that input and most HDTV's do). Then set to the resolution you want such as 1024x768 and then restart the computer (not sage, the computer).

My HDTV is about 3 years old..It does not have a VGA input.

3. If you insist on using component video, try 1024x768 and then restart the computer. But, it still may not work and you may have to mess around with different resolutions to get as good a fit as possible. Best solution is to go VGA because it's going to look a lot more clear anyway.

again 1028 TV out only comes through as 16x9..480 TV out comes through about 3 times as large as my screen

4. Once the problem is corrected so that you see the entire windows desktop on your HDTV - go into Sage and adjust overscan settings as needed. Next, if you need to you can tell Sage (via the Options menu) to use either 4x3, 16x9, Source or Fill).


I have sage in 4x3 and it still shows up as 16x9 when set to 1028 TV out resolution.


Thanks for the ideas..

Gary Ellis

[GKusnick]

720p is by definition a wide-screen (16x9) HD format, so it sounds to me like your TV is doing what it's supposed to do when it letterboxes your 1024x768 desktop. There's a feature in SageTV V6 that lets you specify your screen aspect ratio so things don't look squashed.

Or are you saying that it's not letterboxed, but clipped off at the sides? If so, there ought to be an aspect-ratio setting on your TV to correct that.

If you can't get the 720p format to look good letterboxed, it's possible your TV just doesn't have the resolution to support that format properly. Do you know what the TV's native resolution is (i.e. how many physical pixels it has vertically and horizontally)? Check your specs, or post your specific model number so we can look it up online and have some idea of what you're dealing with.

As for the oversized 480 output, again I suggest updating your video drivers and playing with the driver settings to see if you can adjust that on the PC side.

[blade]

What is the native resolution of your display?

Have you played around with different resolutions? It sounds like you're running at 720p, can your display handle it properly? What happens when you try 1080i and try to underscan the image to fit the screen?

[mike1961]

Another thing to check is some/many HDTV's have a "widescreen/4x3" button on the TV remote and in the setup menu screen on the HDTV (it's built into the TV). Check the TV manual for a widescreen / regular 4x3 modes. So I would check for that and also as many of us have suggested, play around with the screen resolution on the computer.

Mike

[garyellis]

Got some things working today..Thanks for all the help..

My TV accepts 1024I, 480I and 480P.. There is no adjustment for 1024I to make it 4 x 3...The TV always makes 1024I as 16 x 9, and thus I have bars across the top and bottom. I've checked every menu and every manual and there appears to be no changing this. I've been told by some "experts" that some tv's do that and its normal..

Anyway. I set my TV resolution from my Nvidia 6200 to 480I and of course the picture was much larger than the screen, I restarted the computer and the screen came on at the right size...(the desktop is slightly larger than it should be, but I can live with that)..Sage screen was just the right size after adjusting the overscan.. The picture was a little fuzzy...

I left the TV resolution at 480I and changed the desktop resolution to 1024 x768 and my "live tv" picture improved, not sure why, and of course my destop resolution was much better.


So, for now, I have a picture at 480I that is ever so slightly better than my S-video picture was.

The problem now is that any sports channel looks fuzzy. Hard to explain it...kind of like a blurring on the background and a little fuzzy around the players in action.

Thanks for the continued help,

Gary

[mike1961]

Gary - if the sports channels are blurry then may I ask what quality you are recording in? Try experimenting. Some believe "constant kbps" such as Best quality might be better than variable such as DVD standard.

I'm a little confused as to how the TV resolution is adjusted (ie: to 480I). I know how to adjust the desktop resolution but if there is a separate resolution for TV, how is that adjusted and where (on the computer? If so, where)?

Thanks,
Mike

[garyellis]

Thanks Mike...

I am using "Great" quality setting.

as for setting TV resolution...I right click on the desktop and then click on properties. I then click on NVidia control panel..from there I click on TV and it allows me to change between S-video and component and within component between a lot of resolutions..Of course the TV needs to support the one you choose.


EDIT : I just changed Sage recording to "Best" and no difference.

Gary Ellis

[mike1961]

First - changing between S-Video and component is not changing resolutions so much as changing the type of "source input." But, I understand what you mean now.

Regarding it not making a difference with Best quality, you realize you have to make a new recording in Best quality (and not view the one already recorded in Great). Also, what kind of tuner card do you have? I find there are many different things that can affect the quality of the video.

Mike

[garyellis]

tuner cards are Hauppauge 150 and a 500...

But, here is the really frustrating part...I'm watching the hockey game tonight and with all the motion, the picture quality is pretty bad. So, I walk upstairs and my daughter is watching the same game through the MVP using composite video. And the PQ is significantly better than mine from the HTPC through the nvidia 6200 using component cables.

Opus told me that the MVP would be good due to hardware encoding vs. software. If that's true, then how do I get the better encoding in my HTPC instead of using the 6200 card? I guess I could buy a MVP for the main tv room. But, should be a better way.

Thanks for the help,

Gary

[GKusnick]

You mean "decoding", not "encoding". Encoding is what happens when you record the program. Decoding is what happens when you play it back.

Most high-end graphics cards can do hardware-assisted HDTV decoding, but you need to enable 3D acceleration in Sage to get it.

That said, if the 150 and 500 are your only encoders, then you're not recording in HD. So playing it back at high res on a big-screen HD display isn't going to magically make it look better. It's still plain old low-res SDTV, and the bigger you make it, the worse it's going to look.

One thing you can try that might help a little is to use 480p instead of 480i. Generally speaking, progressive scan is preferable to interlaced, all else being equal.

[garyellis]

of course you are right..I meant decoding,,,

is there any card that would get the best hardware decoding?

(I'm sure that would start a debate lol )



Gary Ellis

[mike1961]

Well - to tell you the truth the Hauppauge 150 is OK but in my opinion the PVR 500 is junk. I hated it and never had good PQ at all. I got the NVidia DualTV tuner and I'm much happier with the quality. I set the "encoder merit" to always use the Nvidia first and if we are watching/recording 3 shows at the same time the the Hauppauge 150 is used and the PVR 500 is now gathering dust and may join the ranks of the trash soon.

Honestly - I now have set my defaults down to "fair" quality at .9 gb/hour which is acceptable to me. I could probably get better quality setting the sports to a higher quality but it's fairly clear to me. I've attached a sample jpg snapshot from a video I recorded tonight (at fair quality 0.9 gb/hour with the Nvidia). I believe the quality also has to do with the reception / signal from the DTV channel but all my channels look significantly better with the Nvidia than the Hauppauge. Perhaps you could attach a snapshot of one of your recordings along with a description of the quality you are recording at and the tuner used to record it with.

Mike