STB Firewire (IEEE-1394) Support

[timg11]

I'm trying to get Firewire channel changing working for the first time on my Sci Atl 8300HDC STB. I saw the warning about being sure to only send to the correct Panel Device Number, or it would crash Windows.

How do I determine the Panel Device number?

I looked in Device Manager, and the details tab for Scientific-Atlanta AV/C Panel Device (Explorer 8300HD) has a Device Instance ID.
It is:

AVC\Scientific-Atlanta__Inc.&Explorer(R)_8300HD&TYP_5&ID_0\86C21CEA1C00
                                                       ^^^

Is it safe to assume my Device Number is 0?
My command for channel 1234 would be:

channel -v 0 1234

Follow-up - the assumption above is WRONG. The registry and device manager do not give the panel device number. Please see this message for a correct description of how to determine the Panel Device Number

[Opus4]

Somewhere in the instructions it says to get the device number by looking at the info listed after running 'channel –v' at a command prompt. You are better off using the unique ID with the -n parameter, though, instead of the device number since the device number can change.

- Andy

[timg11]

Originally Posted by Opus4

In order to install firestb.msi on Windows XP instead of MCE, I used the instructions from this post, which said to use this command line:
msiexec /i firestb.msi IDENT="1"

Be sure to pay attention to the Panel Device number(s) for your STBs -- sending some other device number to channel.exe could BSOD Windows... I did it to see what would happen & Windows instantly crashed. You may not want to be as curious as I was. Or, better yet, use the device's unique ID instead.

I'm following Andy's instructions from earlier in this thread to install Firewire channel changing. I have installed ExeMultiTuner and the Firewire drivers for XP (second link).

I am now ready to issue the msiexec command, but I'm not sure if it will crash Windows if the IDENT number is wrong.

In the msiexec command line above, does the IDENT="1" correspond to the Panel Device Number? Or is it the same for every system?

I'm not sure, but I believe the ID of my STB is 0. The device instance string is "AVC\Scientific-Atlanta__Inc.&Explorer(R)_8300HD&TYP_5&ID_0\86C21CEA1C00"

I tried running Channel -v as described in the "SageTV Firewire Settop Box Tuner Setup.pdf " document, but channel.exe has not been installed yet.

[timg11]

Originally Posted by Opus4

Somewhere in the instructions it says to get the device number by looking at the info listed after running 'channel –v' at a command prompt. You are better off using the unique ID with the -n parameter, though, instead of the device number since the device number can change.

- Andy

I went ahead and ran the msiexec /i firestb.msi IDENT="1" command, after making sure the system was OK to crash. It didn't - it ran a normal setup program.

Now I can run CHANNEL.EXE. Channel.exe -v gives this:

C:\Program Files\Timmmoore\MCE 2005 STB Controller>channel -v
Firewire STB channel changer V1.0.15, by timmmoore
1 "FireBus MPEG2TS Tuner Subunit Device"
'Scientific-Atlanta AV/C Tuner Device'
"@device:pnp:\\?\avc#scientific-atlanta__inc.&explorer(r)_8300hd&typ_5&id_0#86c2
1cea1c00#{65e8773d-8f56-11d0-a3b9-00a0c9223196}\global" 0
2 "AVC Panel Device"
'Scientific-Atlanta AV/C Panel Device'

 UniqueID '86c21cea1c00'
 VendorID '1cea'
 ModelID '206c'
 VendorText 'Scientific-Atlanta  Inc.'
 ModelText 'Explorer(R) 8300HD'
"@device:pnp:\\?\avc#scientific-atlanta__inc.&explorer(r)_8300hd&typ_9&id_0#86c2
1cea1c00#{65e8773d-8f56-11d0-a3b9-00a0c9223196}\global" 1
3 'Hauppauge HD PVR Capture Device'
"@device:pnp:\\?\usb#vid_2040&pid_4902#00a284bd#{65e8773d-8f56-11d0-a3b9-00a0c92
23196}\{a5d44047-56a5-4afd-a61c-176bb4ed375b}" 0
Calling CoUninitialize
Called CoUninitialize

Running Channel.exe -n gives this response:

C:\Program Files\Timmmoore\MCE 2005 STB Controller>channel -n
Calling CoUninitialize
Called CoUninitialize

Now that I know the Unique ID, I think the proper syntax for a channel change command for channel 1234 would be"

C:\Pro...ntroller>channel -f -a6 -n 86c21cea1c00 1234

Yes - this works! Now onward to get this integrated into SageTV.....

[timg11]

Originally Posted by Opus4

[*]Deviating from MeInMaui's instructions, I created the EXEMultiTunerPlugin #.ir files before configuring the tuners. They should be placed in the <SageTV install path>\Common\RemoteCodes\EXEMultiTunerPlugin folder. (Note that the subfolder is named 'EXEMultiTunerPlugin', not 'EXEMultiTuner'; the PDF used the wrong folder name at the time of this post.) This might allow choosing the proper device code number during the source setup; if not, you should be able to set it in Source Details later, instead of manaully editing the properties file.

The registry setting for EXEMultiTunerPlugin was configured per MeInMaui's instructions, changing the file path as needed & adding the parameters needed for the 4250HD.

I'm trying to find the specific instructions from MeInMaui regarding the ExeMultiTuner plugin. The exemultitunerplugin.zip contains nothing but a DLL.


I'm not sure what the "#.ir" files are, and I don't have an EXEMultiTUner Plugin folder under "C:\Program Files\SageTV\Common\RemoteCodes".

I found a thread that described some registry setting:
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Sage\EXETunerPlugin]

Farther down the thread it says the registry location is:
HKLM\Software\Frey Technologies\Common\EXEMultiTunerPlugin

I do not have a EXEMultiTunerPlugin key in either location. Do I have to create these manually, or does the DLL do it for me?

After searching many messages, I found the MeInMaui file here in Downloads / Guides and Tutorials

The exemultituner.reg file needs to be edited. I have the path updated to this:
Windows Registry Editor Version 5.00

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Frey Technologies\Common\EXEMultiTunerPlugin]
"command"="C:\\Program Files\\Timmmoore\\MCE 2005 STB Controller\\channelw.exe %DEVICE% %CHANNEL%"

This appears to use the "default format" with the Device ID (single digit like 1 or 2) rather than the Unique ID. Andy recommended using the Unique ID in this format (to prevent problems if the Device ID ever changes):
channel -f -a6 -n 86c21cea1c00 1234

Is there a different variable for %DEVICE% that I should to indicate the Unique ID?
Or do I just ignore the variable and hard-code the device like this:

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Frey Technologies\Common\EXEMultiTunerPlugin]
"command"="C:\\Program Files\\Timmmoore\\MCE 2005 STB Controller\\channelw.exe -f -a6 -n 86c21cea1c00 %CHANNEL%"

[wayner]

Check out post 8 of this thread for more details on how to use the unique ID instead of the panel number in SageTV.

http://forums.sagetv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38493

[timg11]

Wayner, thanks for the tip.

Here's the details from the referenced thread for anyone who's following this.

I figured it out - four steps.

1. Find the Unique ID by running channel -v from a command prompt in the folder that this file is installed (my unique ID is 74bf21471900)
2. Run regedit and change "channelw.exe %DEVICE%" to "channelw.exe -n %DEVICE%"
3. Add a new .ir file with your unique ID - copy the exist file (i.e. 2.ir) to a new file and change the 2 to your unique ID - in my case 74bf21471900.ir
4. Fully shutdown Sage and change the device_name property to your unique ID - in my case 74bf21471900 so - mmc/encoders/1642691032/3/0/device_name= 74bf21471900

1. I have my unique ID: 86c21cea1c00

2. I changed the HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Frey Technologies\Common\EXEMultiTunerPlugin command key to be "C:\Program Files\Timmmoore\MCE 2005 STB Controller\channelw.exe -f -a6 -n %DEVICE% %CHANNEL%"

3. I created a new file 86c21cea1c00.ir containing one line "86c21cea1c00 38000 400 3" in the folder "C:\Program Files\SageTV\Common\RemoteCodes\EXEMultiTunerPlugin"


4. Editing of the sage.properties file: For background, I have 3 capture devices: an HDHomeRun (two tuners) and one HD-PVR (one tuner).


In sage.properties, there is a large group of lines starting with:
mmc/encoders/-431556906
Then there is a large group of lines starting with:
mmc/encoders/1164402825 and mmc/encoders/1164402826
The first one is the HD-PVR, and the last two are the HD-Homerun. You can identify which is which by looking for the "mmc/encoders/-431556906/video_capture_device_name" line in each group.

Here's how I modified the device_name line (it used to be StubDevice):
mmc/encoders/-431556906/90/0/device_name=86c21cea1c00

I also found this line:
mmc/encoders/-431556906/90/0/tuning_plugin=C\:\\Program Files\\SageTV\\Common\\HCWIRBlaster.dll

This needs to be changed to point to the new DLL: "C:\Program Files\SageTV\Common\EXEMultiTunerPlugin.dll".

After my changes (following the \ as escape character convention) it looks like:
mmc/encoders/-431556906/90/0/tuning_plugin=C\:\\Program Files\\SageTV\\Common\\EXEMultiTunerPlugin.dll


After a quick test using LiveTV on the HD-PVR, it seems to work! As I change channels in SageTV, the STB changes correctly.

The next test is to see if it will still work properly when the STB is in "screen saver" mode. With the IR blaster, it always ignored the first digit, so when I wanted 1234, I got 234.

[Opus4]

You seem to be changing some of the instructions w/o needing to.

Examples: The instructions & examples show putting '-n ' in front of '%DEVICE%', instead of changing %DEVICE% to the actual device ID in the registry. And, the 'msiexec /i firestb.msi IDENT="1"' text was the command to get the installer to run on Windows XP instead of MCE; the '1' had nothing to do with a firewire device ID or number, so there was no need to look into changing that value.

If you change the %DEVICE% part of the registry key to a hard-coded ID, you won't be able to control another box if you ever need to be able to do so.

- Andy

[timg11]

Thanks to Andy and Wayner for the help in deciphering this. As someone else has commented, it is a bit daunting to dig through thousands of posts spread over several years to gather an understanding of how to make Firewire work for channel changing. For anyone else who is trying this, Andy's post here is the key one to look at.

There are a couple of things that I wasn't completely sure about that I can clarify here:

1) In step 3, the last two paragraphs are not related. The warning about panel device numbers does not apply to the MSIEXEC command. When I read the last paragraph, I thought it meant that the IDENT= parameter was going to install the firestb.msi for the particular panel device number specified in the IDENT parameter. Not true - the command is the same for all Firewire configurations. The IDENT=1 tells it to install on Windows XP.
Also you won't be able to run channel.exe -v to determine the panel number until you have installed firestb.msi, since that is what does the install.

2) There are two ways to specify a specific STB in the Channel command, either by the panel device number, or by a unique ID. Andy recommends using the unique ID, since the panel device might change if you add or remove Firewire devices in the future. Here's how to identify both from the output of "channel.exe -v" (open a command window in the folder "C:\Program Files\Timmmoore\MCE 2005 STB Controller" to run this command):

C:\Program Files\Timmmoore\MCE 2005 STB Controller>channel -v
Firewire STB channel changer V1.0.15, by timmmoore
1 "FireBus MPEG2TS Tuner Subunit Device"
'Scientific-Atlanta AV/C Tuner Device'
"@device:pnp:\\?\avc#scientific-atlanta__inc.&explorer(r)_8300hd&typ_5&id_0#86c2
1cea1c00#{65e8773d-8f56-11d0-a3b9-00a0c9223196}\global" 0
2 "AVC Panel Device"
'Scientific-Atlanta AV/C Panel Device'

 UniqueID '86c21cea1c00'
 VendorID '1cea'
 ModelID '206c'
 VendorText 'Scientific-Atlanta  Inc.'
 ModelText 'Explorer(R) 8300HD'
"@device:pnp:\\?\avc#scientific-atlanta__inc.&explorer(r)_8300hd&typ_9&id_0#86c2
1cea1c00#{65e8773d-8f56-11d0-a3b9-00a0c9223196}\global" 1

The Panel ID (2) is in magenta, and the unique ID (86c21cea1c00) is in Green.

When using the Unique ID, there are some changes described in various places to use the -n syntax with the Unique ID. I have updated my post here to show exactly what has to be done.

[MeInMaui]

I haven't checked into this thread in a very long time. It looks like I should finally get around to updating the ExeMultiTuner instructions. (I'm amazed it's still in use.) It would be helpful if someone could put together a couple of links to posts that describe the latest thinking on current best practices. Thanks.

Aloha,
Mike

[jerryb33]

A Question on loading the drivers. After following the instructions found in post #1, and doing what Andy did loading the newer drivers and then timmoores file onto my Vista Q6600 machine, I do not have any problems changing channels on my S/A 4250HDC box. (using FWchannelproxy2).

Here is my concern, every time I re-boot the computer it looks for the drivers with the splash screen. I know they are installed as I back out of the screen and I still have channel changing in SAGE. When I look in my device manager, I get the 2 "unknown devices" - which originally we were to remove. I have been removing them when I think about it.

Has anyone seen this, or is there a way to prevent this from trying to install the drivers every time I boot up?
I did try the "don't ask me again" and this did not help.

Can they just be left in the Device Manager?

[timg11]

Jerryb33 - I don't have any unknown devices and the system does not attempt to re-load any drivers on booting. Per the instructions in the link to "STB Firewire Drivers for Windows Vista/XP/MCE" (In Andy's post), I pointed Windows to the folder where I extracted the drivers (using the "Install from a specific location" option) whenever it asked for a driver. I did not have to disable any unknown devices at the end of the process. If I remember correctly, the driver was loaded 4 times.

I don't know how to stop Windows from trying to load drivers if disabling the device in Device Manager doesn't work.

[Clift]

Jerry,

Are you removing the devices or disabling them? Cause, those are two different actions.

[jerryb33]

I have done both, disabling them and uninstalling them. They still try to load on the next boot-up.

The last thing I did was say "don't ask me again" on the driver install screen and did not remove the extra 'unknown devices".

I still get channel changing, so it looks OK. I was just wondering if anyone had a problem with doing this way.

I haven't rebooted since the last procedure ,so I don't know if I'll be ask again. I will let you know.

[Peter_h]

I get an occasional "Hardware Device ID not found error". Channel changing works fine except about once a month or so it wont change channels on one of the boxes. If i power cycle the cable box it starts working again.

Has anyone seen this and have any suggestions on fixing it?

More info.

OS: WHS
Cable boxes: Scientific Atlanta HDC 4250 x 2

[hemicuda]

YES!!! After nearly 3hrs tinkering and wading through the 90+ pgs here I finally got FW recording working on the laptop. Thanks to all who posted tips and methods.

Now, does anyone know of a way to pipe firewire through ethernet similar to the way GridConnect does w/ USB?

[Spritzup]

After trying for the better part of Sunday, I am unable to get video capture to (through firewire) to work with Sage. I can get video capture to work using other pieces of software, however. I've followed the numerous instructions found throughout this thread, but no matter what I do, I can't get Sage to detect a tuner.

Two observations I've had though is that properties file, Sage keeps listing my SA 3250 as being an "ignored tuner" despite me removing that entry multiple times.

mmc/ignore_encoders=MPU-401|NVIDIA DualTV YUV Capture|Scientific-Atlanta AV/C Tuner Device|Logitech QuickCam Communicate STX|Logitech Mic (Communicate STX)|Scientific-Atlanta AV/C Panel Device|NVIDIA DualTV YUV Capture 2|ASUS Xonar DX Audio|

Also, the other issue (or maybe not) is that in the instructions it says to paste in a series of lines in the following format -->

mmc/encoders/12345/1/0/sharpness=170

Is the "12345" the correct number, or is this supposed to be unique to our individual setups? If it's supposed to be unique, where is this unique number to be found?

Any help that you can provide would be appreciated.

Thank you.

[jbuszkie]

IIRC... You are not tuning from the SA3250... So the SA3250 in the ignored section is fine. You are tuning from Sage Graph Recorder. And the 12345 can be any number.. As long as it's not the same as any other encoders in your properties file. If you set it up correctly you should be able to see the SGR encoder in your list with whatever name you gave it in the encoder section of the properties file. Did you set up SGR correctly? Are you running SGR? As in to you see the icon in the tray?

Jim

[Tomahawk51]

Just a Thanks to all Firewire pioneers out there!

I just got a new HD dig cable box (Motorola DCH 3200) and an HD PVR. After thinking I would go IR, but seeing all the issues stemming from having other Hauppauge cards (what a terrible situation that is), I realized the benefit of asking for a box with IEEE 1394 .

So, following all the material, with a special thanks to Opus's post, It's all going smoothly on Vista 32. I only had to use the -f tag.

Thanks again, I'm so happy about getting this up and running without more trouble. I wish those out there luck doing the same.

[limiter]

I just wanted to thank Opus4 for your post about how you got firewire channel changing working. I read all the guides and instructions other people created but there were so many missing pieces (like how to make the WinMCE installer work on XP). Having it all in one post was so helpful instead of searching around the forum for each piece.

I now can change channels w/firewire (all of this done in the hope my HD-PVR stops locking up). Thanks again!