Recording Sage Recordings to DVD Burner

[justme]

one problem i did have with the gui's was i couldn't figure out how to stop them from transcoding. most people record in DVD format so that seems kind of important.

abasu2003,
Are you sure that it wasn't demuxing and remuxing/splitting the mpegs into Vob files rather than transcoding? It is neccessary to use mplex to make sure the mpegs will work with DVDauthor. Also we found out in the MPEGIIDVD project that demuxing your mpegs is often neccessary to get them to be accepted by mplex for DVDauthor. It adds an extra step, but you can't(at least we didn't work too much on it) reliably tell which files will go thru DVDauthor(and it assorted toolset) and which won't. In the end it ended up easier to just demux and then use mplex to remux. Of course this stage was needed to use the opensource mpeg2 editting apps we looked at so we didn't look into it too much.

Simply creating them with an XML file as you've stated is not really true. There's tons of other things dealing with making your own menu MPG files and subtitles as buttons that you've gotta setup just for the XML config'd buttons to work.

KJake,
Believe me I realize it's not quite that simple. But as abasu2003 points out, things can be simplified. Although at the cost of versatility, but if someone really wants total menu creation then they should leave the Sage UI IMHO. What I had enviosioned doing back when I was working on this was using a few XML files as templates and only doing slight mods as needed for the shows detailed info. We could use the SageTV background for the menus and use the SageTV style(simplifying/standardizing the xml) for the menu's structure as well. Sort of like what Tivo did with their DVD burning PVR. For the first try I think we should skip editting, as this requires more work in the SageTV UI(see my comments in the PS)

I love the DVDauthorGUI located here. It comes with a compiled win32 binary for the most recent stable version of DVDauthor and all it's assorted tools(not all we need for the final project but enough to get started). Still I think it's main use to this project would be to follow it's approach. I personally don't see the need to build the DVDauthorGUI into SageTV. I think we(again see my PS) can make our own simple actual SageTV UI and then expand it, as needed.

PS:In case anyone hasn't figured it out, I went into all of this a long time ago(I'm the edtee from the Meedio/myHTPC forum). I will honestly admit to certian parts(XML generation as an example) being over my head(I'm not really a coder), in the end. This is the reason there isn't already a STV addon with the general abilities talked about above. I just ran out of steam without any help in my many weak spots. It's been a long time and I've forgotten much of the DVD building specific stuff I learned, not to mention I'm not as healthy as I used to be. But if there is anything I can do PM me. I'm not great(like Neilm or Cayars) but maybe I can add the parts to Sage that you guys need. If you guys help, I'm sure we can come up with something basic. We can then worry about expanding it from there. Maybe we'll attract the attention of one of the "real" STV experts. But I will offer to help out in the meantime. Anyway PM me if you are interested and have the programming skill/time.

/justme

[KJake]

Thanks justme, this info helped.

I've got some plans to try somethings out tonight after work, I'll post screenshots if they're not too ugly

[KJake]

that was a bust - sorry - nothing tonight.
Plus I picked up a Sun Spac IPX from work and had some fun playing with that ... so I neglected this a little bit.

Also, justme - I agree that we should not built a dvdauthor front-end into Sage.

[infiniti_guy]

If I wanted to do it the simple way (without adding DVD menu editing functions- e.g. just burn directly to the DVD as is with no menu), would it be possible to place a "Burn to DVD" option on the recorded program screen (for the specific recorded TV show- say next to the "Watch Now" commanmd)?

I'm not sure if this is something that's easily possible or not, but I think a lot of Sage users would like this.

-Infiniti_guy

[abasu2003]

i think thats what we're working on. however, there are command line dvd burners that you can configure to just pass through the episode name.

[abasu2003]

People should look at DVD Styler also for a simple GUI

[KJake]

A small update...I've got the DVD menu structure working the way I want it to.
I've ditched motion menus for now because they're much harder to do.

I'm moving on to dynamically placing text on an image now. This is going to be tricky I think.

The fun part is going to be when I have to put all of this together. Sounds like I should code it up in Java for it to be easier to implement in Sage. It's been a while since I've written any, but I'll update again when I get something working that you all can see.

[justme]

A small update...I've got the DVD menu structure working the way I want it to.
I've ditched motion menus for now because they're much harder to do.

Cool. As for the motion menu I'm definitely not for animated, so you staying static is good news to me. I say keep it simple, for now.
Maybe I should PM you some screenshots of a mock up(generated by Sage) of what I'm thinking of as far a Menu structure. I thinking of like a main menu(lists the shows on the DVD) that then drops to a sub(which has the shows detailed info) for the actual show. This means we only have x+1 menus, were x is the number of shows being burnt. I'm open to different ideas I just wanted to let you know what I was thinking. What are you thinking, menu structure wise? Are we basically on the same page?

I'm moving on to dynamically placing text on an image now. This is going to be tricky I think.

The easiest way for me to supply the show info to you is an XML dump similiar to like what Malore did in his first STV. This should give you an idea of what to expect, as far as format.

The fun part is going to be when I have to put all of this together. Sounds like I should code it up in Java for it to be easier to implement in Sage. It's been a while since I've written any... .

At this stage the Language shouldn't be that big of a deal. Depending on how you code it, the langauge shouldn't matter. If you go with more of a Comskip style approach, then it can be totally language independent. We can just pass the proccessed data back and forth. This is basically what the current comskip does. Basically, it is called by Sage and given the data to proccess the correct show. Comskip then outputs the data that the STV then uses to make the correct actions in the Sage UI.

...but I'll update again when I get something working that you all can see

I'd love to see anything you have, ASAP(but no pressure). This would help me know what I can and can't do for you. Or what I should try and have exposed for you.

Big thanks for doing this. Without help from someone like you, I'd never be able to properly do this. After all this time I'll just be happy to have a simple app that works. This should help spur farther development(hopefully after lots of user interest ).

/justme

[KJake]

Originally Posted by justme

The easiest way for me to supply the show info to you is an XML dump

This would be a great way of getting the show info.

Originally Posted by justme

At this stage the Language shouldn't be that big of a deal. Depending on how you code it, the langauge shouldn't matter.

I agree now. Heck, my first working release of this will probably be a batchfile.

[KJake]

So, here's what I've got for an actual working menu.
This is the SubMenu that'll contain Detailed Info about the show.
From here, you can play the selected show, or return back to the main menu to select a different show.

[KJake]

Hey - progress made.
This is interesting I think...

I figured if we're going to dynamic graphics, why not start with the easiest dynamic graphics tool first. SUBTITLES.

I got this working and I think it's got potential for being a solution, but I've got some problems with it though:

1) The text was created through a process of 3 subtitles so that I could get text size and position on the screen.
2) Using Text Subtitles on the same screen apparently disables/breaks highlight button graphics. They show up until the subtitle text displays and then they're gone. The buttons still work, but you have no idea which one you've selected. This needs to be fixed.
3) Subtitle text is ugly.

Feedback appreciated. I'm probably going to burn this to test on my DVD player to see what it all really looks like on the TV.

[KJake]

Much updated tonight...

Title, Description, and Details are loaded from a XML file that I statically created in hopes that I will be able to get XML Show data from Sage.

Those 3 sections are then written onto a Still Frame Background, Encoded, Joined with a Silent Audio track, and then the menu button highlights are Muxed into the final MPEG.

The nice part about this is that it's all CLI and the only input needed so far takes place in the XML file.

Much logic work needs to be done to handle more than 1 title now...but that's for another day.

Also, since I'm doing things this way now, I decided to keep everything at the PNG level until the very last step and this change has created a much nicer background image after being encoded and muxed.

Tonight's screenshot featuring sudo-dynamic text that looks a helluva lot better than last night's attempt.

Edit: uploaded a new screen shot with better looking button hightlights.

[justme]

Great improvement. That looks great.

Title, Description, and Details are loaded from a XML file that I statically created in hopes that I will be able to get XML Show data from Sage.

If you're using the Malore stlye of XML, then I can assure you we can get you the show's detailed info. One thing I was thinking we should add to Malore's XML dump code is the mpeg's full path. You're going to need that info for later processing of the mpegs. Of course any changes(demux/remuxs/edits) to these mpegs should go to a seperate DVD burning working directory. I was thinking of dumping the file pathes in a seperate XML file along with any other info you feel you need for proper processing. This way we keep the XML file for the actual detailed info menus simpler.

Editted to add a zip contianing 2 sample XML dumps

[KJake]

Originally Posted by justme

If you're using the Malore stlye of XML, then I can assure you we can get you the show's detailed info.

I'm not sure what that format is...mine is basic:
<sageinfo>
<title>Happy Days</title>
<description>Al has a fish fry. (CC)</description>
<details>Air Date: 11/23/2004\nRated: TV-G\nRun time: 0:30</details>
</sageinfo>

Notice the \n to add a new line in the picture.

I guess this can change, it's not a big deal, but lets change it now before I get too used to it

I'm also looking at my screen shot here at work and that menu highlight looks ugly, I'm going to change it back to the old color that I had in my first SS I posted...looks much better.

Edit: I couldn't stand it anymore, so I did it now. The ugly one is gone.

[KJake]

I took it easy tonight and all I added in was ISO creation and Burning the ISO to a supplied Drive letter. It works, but isn't worth much yet.

[KJake]

Here's a dump of what the heck I did tonight.

I don't have the full menu generation going yet, but I made progress on making this way more dynamic than it was with handling more than 1 title. I've only test 4 'fake' titles. Also, I started on the Top Level Menu that'll bring you into the menu that I've been showing previously.

Enjoy - these are just the JPG files that the program produces - no screen shots of the actual menus tonight.

[KJake]

So...in essance the Menu System for this project is COMPLETE! Yay.
Well, not exactly, but close. The imaging part is done and it all gets put together automatically. The part(s) that have not been worked on yet are 1) getting XML info from Sage, 2) diving into actually encoding/packaging/muxing/rejiging Sage video files and 3) building the interface in Sage that the user will use to drive all of this mumbojumbo.

All of this is being looked into, but it will take some time.

I leave you with a link to a WMV that I created to showcase the actual Menu and it's structure. There is definately room for enhancements here. The clip is about 400K and 0:37 long. Once I do eventually hit 'Play' you get to see my inspiration for this setup.

Feedback, comments welcome at this point...

http://www.kjake.net/sage/dvdmenu.wmv

[taltman]

Guys this forum rocks! I have some more information that might help...

Thanks to Crashless I found this information about the mpeg2dvd programs:

http://www.meedio.com/forum/viewtopi...light=mpeg2dvd

All the instructions you need are in that thread. Let me know if you get it working.

/Tal

[KJake]

Yup, I found the same info taltman. Thanks for finding it again tho. I'm going to need to read up on it to start in on the actual video file recipe I need to concoct. The thing they didn't do is create a menu...*at all!* So, since this info was out there already, I got started on the hardest part of setting up a dynamic menu system. That part is almost done, but I'm going to hopefully have time to start on the video stuff tonight.

[KJake]

taltman, good news, I'm even closer tonight. Assuming that there are no bugs, which there are, all that's left is SageTV integration. I have the full DVD structure working and processing from the original Sage .mpg files. There's just a little too much manual things going on right now and much more testing needs to take place so that we know this will work on everyone's systems.