Which decoder filters?

[Todd33]

Originally Posted by domc

Can you tell us what your exact settings are in the video setup? I downloaded the Purevideo drivers and didn't make my blurry picture better.

Do these drivers work for LIVE TV? Do these drivers work with the PVR-150 card?

I find the Nvidia decoder not worth the hassle. I cannot tell the difference in picture, I switched back and forth over and over and saw nothing. It also pretty much forces you to use FSE which leads to more headaches. FSE is more prone to lockups and also spins the GPU fan up making more noise. I found FSE off and the default decoder looks just as good and mkes the system quieter and more stable.

I think the Nvidia thing is a case of people buying something and then telling others how well it works in an effort to convince themselves it was money well spent. Maybe it does help the picture with large projection screens, but not on my 37" LCD.

I really wanted Purevideo to be the Holly Grail, $15 is nothing, but it really only has cons on my setup. I also don't watch DVDs on my HTPC, maybe that is another reason it isn't worth it.

[blade]

Originally Posted by Todd33

I find the Nvidia decoder not worth the hassle. I cannot tell the difference in picture, I switched back and forth over and over and saw nothing. It also pretty much forces you to use FSE which leads to more headaches. FSE is more prone to lockups and also spins the GPU fan up making more noise. I found FSE off and the default decoder looks just as good and mkes the system quieter and more stable.

I think the Nvidia thing is a case of people buying something and then telling others how well it works in an effort to convince themselves it was money well spent. Maybe it does help the picture with large projection screens, but not on my 37" LCD.

I really wanted Purevideo to be the Holly Grail, $15 is nothing, but it really only has cons on my setup. I also don't watch DVDs on my HTPC, maybe that is another reason it isn't worth it.

The Nvidia decoder is much better than the one that comes with Sage or any other decoder I've tried. If you installed the Nvidia decoder then switched back and forth from Default to Nvidia then you didn't see any difference because the default decoder was the Nvidia decoder. The default decoder is always the last one installed unless you manually change it. If you couldn't tell a difference between the Sage decoder and the Nvidia one then you definitely have something wrong somewhere because the difference is drastic, especially for Nvidia 6xxx and above cards.

The Nvidia Decoder helps more for TV viewing than it does for DVD's. You don't have to use FSE to use the Nvidia decoder. The only time I need to use FSE is when trying to run using VMR9 at 1080i. This is a problem with the video card not the decoder.

[rp1790]

Well, I have a FX5200 card and also can't see any difference between the Sage decoder and the Purevideo one. Maybe it's because I have a SD TV but it makes no difference and for me was a waste of money.

And, yes I have switched multiple times between the Sage Decode (not using the "default") and the Nvidia decoder.

[jptaz]

I would say it is probably not much different given a Standard TV. The NVidia decoder really makes a difference when you are using an HD TV and you have Nvidia 6X Card.

[Todd33]

I have a 7800GT.

I switched back and forth between the Purevideo, Sage and Hauppage decoders, all three look close enough that I can't tell. This is on a 37" LCD running at 1920x1080. If it is so drastic, can you link a screenshot using Fraps?

I do need to run in FSE, otherwise the picture is jittery on a 4400+ w/ 2GB ram.

I want to believe there is a difference, I just canot see it.

[jptaz]

Maybe I am seeing more of a difference between VMR9 and Overlay. I can't use VMR9 with Hauppauge ofr SageTV decoders because it takes too much CPU. With 4400+ I doubt that is an issue.

John

[domc]

Originally Posted by Todd33

I find the Nvidia decoder not worth the hassle. I cannot tell the difference in picture, I switched back and forth over and over and saw nothing.

Damn, I just took your advice and changed my video driver in sagetv to Cyberlink (powerdvd) and the picture on my TV is excellent now. I've been fooling around with the Purevideo drivers for a week or two without great success and getting very frustrated. Now I'm happy. I figured that everyone suggested using them so Purevideo must be the best. Glad I didn't spend the money and was using the trial version only.

Moral of the story, Purevideo decoders are not the best in some people's situation. Maybe good for DVD playback/large lcd's but not for Standard TV watching.

Thanks for the tip!!

[blade]

Originally Posted by Todd33

I have a 7800GT.

I switched back and forth between the Purevideo, Sage and Hauppage decoders, all three look close enough that I can't tell. This is on a 37" LCD running at 1920x1080. If it is so drastic, can you link a screenshot using Fraps?

I do need to run in FSE, otherwise the picture is jittery on a 4400+ w/ 2GB ram.

I want to believe there is a difference, I just canot see it.

I assume you were using Nvidia Decoder and not Nvidia Post Processing?

If I can find the time I'll try to grab some screenshots; however, the improvement in PQ is much more noticeable in video. I can easily see a big difference just by watching the scrolling text on Fox News. Of course I'm watching on a 57" instead of a 37" so I'm sure it's a little easier for me to spot the jaggies, blurry movement, and deinterlacing artifacts of the other decoders.

Your CPU and Ram have nothing to do with the stuttering. It's your video card. The Nvidia cards just don't handle VMR9 at 1080i very well.

If you can't see it then great, don't spend the money. There is a difference though. I can't see the difference in many of the things people talk about here so I don't worry about it. When I do start noticing what they're talking about then I start tweaking again.

[blade]

Originally Posted by domc

Moral of the story, Purevideo decoders are not the best in some people's situation. Maybe good for DVD playback/large lcd's but not for Standard TV watching.

There's no doubt on a smaller set or a SDTV set that the differences won't be as noticable. They do great for SDTV content being displayed on a HDTV.

[blade]

Here's some screenshots. Let me just say this is the first time I've ever taken screenshots so they may not be perfect frame by frame comparisions, but are close enough that you should be able to easily see the differences. Also like I said before the differences are much greater when the video is actually playing than it is in a still shot. What may seem like a small difference in one frame can be quite drastic when you're seeing 30-60 fps.

All captures were of analog cable at 3.2 gig/hr using a PVR-500. Playback was with a 6600GT at 720p, VMR9, Per-Pixel Adaptive, FSE Disabled, with the video stretched to fill a 16*9 screen. I used the latest Nvidia Decoder and the Sage Decoder.

Notice how many more jaggies the Sage Decoder has on the lamp shade, chair (in front of the table), station logo, credits, couch, and pillows on the couch.

PureVideo1
Sage1


In this one it's easy enough to see how much smoother the lines are with the Nvidia Decoder.

PureVideo2
Sage2


Once again notice how much smoother the lines are with the Nvidia Decoder. Especially her right shoulder and face where it's set against the white board behind her. If you look at her coat you'll notice the edges are smoother. Of course the station logo is obvious as well.

PureVideo3
Sage3


The lines on the sidewalk and the bottom of the bus. When actually watching the video those lines flickered badly with the Sage decoder where as the Nvidia was smooth.

PureVideo4
Sage4


This one is so obvious I'll let you pick it out on your own.

Unfortunately I didn't capture the exact same frame and the OSD was on, but all the frames with the Sage decoder looked the same. When watching the video the flickering was so bad it almost looked like the lines were moving side to side.

PureVideo5
Sage5


Most of the captures were of pretty poor quality because of the analog cable so I wanted to include one decent looking one so you didn't think all my recordings looked like crap.

PureVideo6

[Todd33]

Sorry to bump an old thread (but still useful!). I came back too late, the above links don't work any longer.

I have been playing with ffdshow+Cyberlink decoder and the TV recorded video looks much better now without having to use FSE. I'm wondering how I can do the same with DVDs now, but I read the AACS encryption stops ffdshow post-processing. I found some triaql software (DVD??pro) that strips the AACS on the fly, but I while playing DVDs in Sage it still ignores ffdshow. Any ideas?