Just when I thought I couldn't be any happier with my Xcard....

[cmaffia]

Actually it is 13x2 :-) I just drew the rows side by side.
Regardless, pin 15 looks necessary according to your documentation.
But before I go crazy... how much better is Sage's output to TV (I would use S-VIDEO) when compared to current Nvidia/ATI cards?? If it is a downgrade in output, then I wont spend any more time on this project.
Thanks!

Originally Posted by krass

Cmaffia -

Looking at the quote below, I'm not sure that it will work without pin 15 being there. If you could solder a pin into the solder point where 15 should be, it may work, but looking at your representation of the VIP, you may have to build a custom cable.

Edited: Did some more research on the VIP port and it is what I thought it was, so you would have to build a custom cable seeing as how the VIP is 13x2 and your diagram was showing a 25x1. That or you meant to have 14-26 right under 1-13.

[krass]

Cmaffia -

Sages output to TV is as good as the Codec is, unless you are talking about the UI, in which case, the UI is fairly intuitive and easy to use, as well as looks good.

I'm assuming that when you said Sages ouput, you really meant Xcards output, in which case I can only assume from discussions that it is similar to the 350's. If that is the case, then the Xcard output will look quite a bit better than using just your s-video out from your graphics adapter.

Hope this helps.

[cmaffia]

What I actually mean is that I would be downgrading my current Video Card which currently outputs via SVIDEO to my TV and does not have VIP header.
The video card I am looking to get (GeForce3 TI200) is at least 3 years old and will be outputing both the Xcard output (via the VIP header) and Windows XP/Sage. My question is how will the output of these older cards with the VIP header compare to GeForce5/6 generations?

Originally Posted by krass

Cmaffia -

Sages output to TV is as good as the Codec is, unless you are talking about the UI, in which case, the UI is fairly intuitive and easy to use, as well as looks good.

I'm assuming that when you said Sages ouput, you really meant Xcards output, in which case I can only assume from discussions that it is similar to the 350's. If that is the case, then the Xcard output will look quite a bit better than using just your s-video out from your graphics adapter.

Hope this helps.

[krass]

Cmaffia -

Ok, now I understand what you are getting at. To answer that question then, is fairly easy. The vid card is basically just acting as a pass-thru, your video would actually be coming from the Xcard which used hardware decoding, which IMHO is far superior to what you can get from any software decoding through a Geforce5/6 generation card.

[cmaffia]

Let's take the Xcard out of the picture.

How does the TV-Output of a GeForce3 card compare to GeForce5/6 or even a fairly new ATI card? Is it just as clear as the current generation? Video Performace same or Worse? Will I have problems with the GeForce3 card regarding full screen? Will it leave black borders on tops or sides? My current cards came with utilities that corrected these problems.

OR

Are you saying that the output of both Windows and Xcard is coming from the TV-OUT of the Xcard and not my primary card???

Where is the final output coming from??

Originally Posted by krass

Cmaffia -

Ok, now I understand what you are getting at. To answer that question then, is fairly easy. The vid card is basically just acting as a pass-thru, your video would actually be coming from the Xcard which used hardware decoding, which IMHO is far superior to what you can get from any software decoding through a Geforce5/6 generation card.

[krass]

Cmaffia -

From previous posts, it sounds like you may still have the black borders, probably around 1/4" or so around the screen, maybe more, but I believe you would have that with the 5/6 gen boards also. You will probably need to tweak the system through tvtool or powerstrip to reduce the borders.

As far as quality between the the GF3 and the 5/6gen boards, I would assume that quality is fairly similar, but may be a bit crisper then the GF3. To be fairly blunt, I've never been impressed by the TV-out on anything other than an All-In-Wonder card, the rest look really terrible to me.

[cmaffia]

My Asus Punit-R has an on board ATI all-in-wonder card and TV-Out is better than the Nvidia flavors (not by much)
Thanks for the info

Originally Posted by krass

Cmaffia -

From previous posts, it sounds like you may still have the black borders, probably around 1/4" or so around the screen, maybe more, but I believe you would have that with the 5/6 gen boards also. You will probably need to tweak the system through tvtool or powerstrip to reduce the borders.

As far as quality between the the GF3 and the 5/6gen boards, I would assume that quality is fairly similar, but may be a bit crisper then the GF3. To be fairly blunt, I've never been impressed by the TV-out on anything other than an All-In-Wonder card, the rest look really terrible to me.

[AWS]

I wouldn't suppose they make a 5200 video card with a full VIP header, do they? We're pretty much stuck with a Ti200 or Ti500, right? (GF3 era)

[cmaffia]

That's what I use now on my secondary Sage box.. yeah.. wishful thinking :-)

Originally Posted by AWS

I wouldn't suppose they make a 5200 video card with a full VIP header, do they? We're pretty much stuck with a Ti200 or Ti500, right? (GF3 era)

[AWS]

I just got an Asus Ti500 (V8200 Deluxe) but I really want that DVI port! OH well. Guess S-Vid will have to do.

[cmaffia]

Hmm in my research I thought the only difference between the Ti200 and Ti500 was that the Ti500 HAD the DVI port

Originally Posted by AWS

I just got an Asus Ti500 (V8200 Deluxe) but I really want that DVI port! OH well. Guess S-Vid will have to do.

[AWS]

Originally Posted by cmaffia

Hmm in my research I thought the only difference between the Ti200 and Ti500 was that the Ti500 HAD the DVI port

The difference in the two is the operating memory frequency... I did find that one brand, Suma, DOES have a DVI port, which I didn't know... HERE BUT the card didn't have the VIP header pins. UGH.

[krass]

Tried that 6600 GT solution finally. I have to say that I am fairly impressed with the quality of the TV-out (S-Video) to the TV, looks pretty good, and the image quality is not bad when viewing TV. There are a few downsides to using the 6600 that i've found so far. One is that I need a monitor hooked up to get rid of the 1/2" black bars arouind the screen, if you cover about half the Sage window with another application that screen freezes of hiccups, and I really am having a hard time with using a $250 "gaming" card for the PVR.

[cmaffia]

I ordered from Ebay two cards that I haven't gotten yet:

Nvidia Quadro 64MB DDR with SVIDEO out and VIP header
Asus v8200 with SVIDEO out and VIP header

Once I try both I will let you know the results.

-cmaffia

[blade]

Originally Posted by krass

Tried that 6600 GT solution finally. I have to say that I am fairly impressed with the quality of the TV-out (S-Video) to the TV, looks pretty good, and the image quality is not bad when viewing TV. There are a few downsides to using the 6600 that i've found so far. One is that I need a monitor hooked up to get rid of the 1/2" black bars arouind the screen, if you cover about half the Sage window with another application that screen freezes of hiccups, and I really am having a hard time with using a $250 "gaming" card for the PVR.

I use a 6600GT without a monitor connected to it and have no problems at all. The drivers allow for adjustment to eliminate over and underscan problems. Also mine doesn't freeze up if another application is on top of Sage. Of course I'm outputting via component and not s-video.

[cmaffia]

But these cards don't have VIP header?

Originally Posted by blade

I use a 6600GT without a monitor connected to it and have no problems at all. The drivers allow for adjustment to eliminate over and underscan problems. Also mine doesn't freeze up if another application is on top of Sage. Of course I'm outputting via component and not s-video.

[AWS]

Originally Posted by cmaffia

But these cards don't have VIP header?

Correct. I haven't seen a video card with a VIP header on it since the GeForce3 series (and not including the XCard)

[cmaffia]

Please help! Why does the Xcard overload/distort all of my Sage Recordings??

I saw some old threads where many users had this problem but none of the threads had a solution.

I am testing on my lab PC the Xcard/VIP header solution using Sage Client for my initial tests and all recordings from both of my Sage Boxes are completely distorted.

Any help or suggestions?

It distorts whether I output straight from the Xcard (using analog out not SPDIF) or if I go out of the Xcard to the line in of my PC. (Yes I adjusted and tweaked volume and recording controls in XP) SPDIF is not an alternative option to test as I do not have a SPDIF audio card.

Thanks!

[cmaffia]

TVedia seems to be the only PVR that has native support for Xcard
http://www.8dim.com/products/default.asp
Anyone try this software?

"TVedia is the only software on the market that fully supports SigmaDesigns Xcard. It can not only playback media files using Xcard, taking advantage of hardware based decoding to reduce the requirement of your PC speed when it's possible, it can also playback DVD with Xcard, and display all on screen user interface with semi-transparent overlay through Xcard. A patent pending OSD engine overcomes Xcard's 256 color OSD restriction to display images with a full range of colors, so user interface is as vibrant as displayed on a 32 bit colored PC display."

[something fishy]

@cmaffia
I used to use TVedia. It is fine as a media player (basically it will play anything that there's a directshow filter for intelligently mixing software decoders with the xcard as required). Its pretty solid, certainly as reliable as Sage.

But if you're used to Sage as a PVR you won't be happy with TVedia. Its scheduling functions are more like a VCR than a true PVR (recordings done through the epg are locked to physical time slots not to program names/key words). No real program search etc.

The picture quality using TVedia through the xcard's s-video out is better than I can get using Sage but Sage finds and records things for me that I would miss using Tvedia. I'd rather watch something at a lower picture quality than not watch it at all.

(In the archives you will find me an aggressive lobbyist for Tvedia because of the reliability and its xcard support; I have had bad Sage+PVR350 experiences. I still wish that Sage natively supported the xcard, DVD included. But you should consider me one of the converted - I'll put up with less good deinterlacing if I have to).